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Author Topic: idols from the mind. What if...???  (Read 1698 times)

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moshe

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idols from the mind. What if...???
« on: April 08, 2013, 04:56:19 AM »

I have a question(s).

What if there was an strict formula to overcome idols from the mind? Does anybody have thought about it? Any ideas how would that be?

See. I believe it's easier for us to oversome certain inconvenient thing when we get to know exactly how it works, because we can't get fool anymore since we know exactly what is going on, which are the ugly consequences, the undesired outcome.

But, then again, there are also sides from idols from the heart that can't be removed with knowledge, because they are guided primary by uncontrollable emotions that have got into our brains way long before we physically fall into whatever we fall.

we tent to say that personal change is a miracle, and I agree, but miracles don't always have to happen in such a MYSTIC way. I believe there is a reason why Paul used to take so much into account what we think about all day long.

For me, just being here, thinking about these and probably you reading these, is already a miracle.

any thoughts/opinions/facts?






ps. by idols from the mind, I mean--Lost of eyes, lost of the flesh and the pride of life, (VANITY).


« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 02:43:43 AM by Moises G. »
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: idols from the mind. What if...???
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2013, 04:06:47 PM »

How do we know we even 'have' idols unless He shows us?  What is one way He shows us?  I think it's by His unbroken (un-contradicting) and agreeing Word.  When you can hold all scripture in your mind and LIVE without contradiction and with agreement, you'll have no idols of the heart.

I wouldn't call it a 'formula'--more a fact of Spiritual life, but:

1Jn 1:9,10 If we should be avowing our sins, He is faithful and just that He may be pardoning us our sins and should be cleansing us from all injustice.  If we should be saying that we have not sinned, we are making Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

Do I have some?  Of course.  Maybe many.  But more and more I want to smash their noses off rather than polish them up and get others to admire them too.

     
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.

moshe

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Re: idols from the mind. What if...???
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2013, 03:30:00 AM »

Hi Dave.
I think you gave a very good point. If we are ever going to overcome our idols from the mind first we have to know that these are there. Mentioning avowing our sins and remembering that we have sinned should be surely part of that ''formula'' (a method, pattern, or rule for doing or producing something, often one proved to be successful).

This also comes to my mind,

      Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthyómeditate on these things.


I admit that now days, on the information age and all this available technologies is hard to find time for meditation. But I am guessing that this kind of meditation and giving thanks for EVERYTHING, even that that could come to make us anxious; must be part of the ''method, pattern, rule --formula'' to overcome our

idols from the hearth, because for how our minds work; our actions are a consequence of our thoughts

(conditioned by our life experiences), fulled by our deepest emotions and desires (the heart).


any other point/out there?



« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 03:35:57 AM by Moises G. »
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moshe

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Re: idols from the mind. What if...???
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2013, 04:02:14 AM »

John
good contribution. Remembering constantly that it depends of God to save us and that eventually He is going to save everybody must be is of paramount importance on our way to overcome our idols.

 I believe that thinking about these and trying to find a patter/method from the Scriptures to overcome is not a waste of time. I certainly know that we will not find a final answer on a couple posts at one forum, neither do am I trying to impply that anyone reading these points will then be able to just follow them and get over with all his idols. Overcoming has to be our ''destiny''; every impulse and experience that we live since the moment we are born is part of the domino effect that will eventually give us the knowledge and strength to smash those idols from our heart. But many times God decides to put in our way the Scriptures and information from very good writers (like Ray) to accomplish our salvation.

Personally, I don't feel worry about overcoming some things that I don't have the strength yet to overcome, I know someday if God's will, I will have it, it's my desire, I am not worry,  actually I feel inspired to find more answers. So here am I, just asking questions and sharing my thoughts.

so far, we should

-avowing our sins and remembering that we have sinned

-do meditation (on anything true, noble, just, pure, lovely, of virtue...) and give thanks for EVERYTHING

-Remembering constantly that it depends of God to save us and that eventually He is going to save everybody
(1Ti 2:3-4  For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. )



« Last Edit: April 10, 2013, 12:03:49 PM by Moises G. »
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: idols from the mind. What if...???
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2013, 05:40:27 AM »

Excerpt from LOF series #3 (http://bible-truths.com/lake3.html):

And so we are assured that EVERYONE will be "revealed," "tried," "salted," and "baptized" "in FIRE." And these fiery trials as Peter calls them go on for a lifetime. If it were real, physical fire, all believersí lives would be short indeed. God is SPIRIT, and God is a CONSUMING FIRE. It is Godís SPIRIT that is likened to fire. The spiritual teaching in this symbol is to recognize what real fire accomplishes and to then use that as an analogy as to what God DOES TO US (or more properly FOR US).

Fire does a number of things:

1.  Fire CHANGES things. Fire brings about molecular changes in the materials that are burned. Godís spiritual fire will make changes in our mind, heart, and spirit.
   
2.  Fire PURGES. In times past if a building were diseased and rat-infested, they would purge away the filth by burning it down. We are to be purged from all our diseases of sin and carnality. Jesus Christ paid the penalty of sin for us, but now God wants to get at the root and core of what caused us to sin in the first place. We all need desperately to be CHANGED and PURGED.
   
3.  Fire BURNS UP combustible materials that have no value in saving. God will burn out of all of us the straw, grass, and stubble, which represent evil and wrong doctrines, idols of the heart, and philosophies that exalt themselves against God.
 
4.  Fire PURIFIES things of value which we do want to retain. The analogy is used in the Scriptures of purifying gold by fire to make it more beautiful and more valuable. Gold represents the highest doctrines of spiritual understanding such as the Love of God and the Sovereignty of God, and salvation of all.

No one teaches us more regarding the fiery trials of life than the apostle to the nations, Paul. Paul was "revealed, tried, salted, and baptized" in Godís "CONSUMING FIRE," and yet never a single hair on his head was ever singed.

--------------------------------------------

Calling attention mostly to # 3 above.  It may not exactly 'define' idols of the heart, but placing it with 'evil and wrong doctrines and philosophies' helps explain what 'idols of the heart' are. 

I'm not sure every weakness, failing, and "diseases of sin and carnality" are "idols of the heart".  A better example would be belief in the myth of free-will.  That's an 'evil and wrong' doctrine that is not only held 'intellectually' but also affects our lives.   

Either way, they will come under fire.
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.

moshe

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Re: idols from the mind. What if...???
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2013, 05:21:42 AM »

Idol. a. An image used as an object of worship. b. A false god.
2. One that is adored, often blindly or excessively.
3. Something visible but without substance.


So. yes. Either way, all our idols will come under God's spiritual fire. For us, it should be better sooner than later...

My deduction regarding what an idol from the heart/mind could be, would be whatever that is a false god to us, it would probably be nothing visible since the idol is from the mind, however, certain physical things can certainly show or represent the effects of this idols.

Examples,
As already mentioned: 
'evil and wrong doctrines and philosophies': 'freewill', also the 'hell' doctrine, the 'trinity', tithing, etc...

Some others:
living for pleasure, continuous self gratification --(hedonism).

self piety, illusion of being a ''good person'', religiosity (pride, lack of trust in God).

greed, envy, obsession for fame, power and control.



  These things only; cover many others. For now, I can't think on anymore.


« Last Edit: April 12, 2013, 12:18:18 AM by Moises G. »
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moshe

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Re: idols from the mind. What if...???
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2013, 12:55:26 AM »


Well. Here is my last contribution to this topic, for whatever is worth.


And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue (exelence); and to

virtue knowledge (The state or fact of knowing.);

And to knowledge temperance (self-control); and to temperance

patience (endurance); and to patience godliness (piety);

And to godliness brotherly kindness (Greek word 'philadelphia': love of the brethren, fraternal

afection); and to brotherly kindness charity (Greek word 'agape': agape love).

...for if ye do these things, ye shall never (double negative strengthening the denial; not at all: - any more, at all, by any (no) means, neither, never, no (at all), in no case (wise), nor ever, not (at all, in any wise)) fall



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