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If you are the son of god..

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lareli:

--- Quote from: loretta on April 20, 2014, 08:11:55 AM ---
--- Quote from: largeli on April 18, 2014, 03:07:30 PM ---If the church was going to be taken over by imposters and wolves in sheeps clothing soon after these instructions were written then what does it profit us now to have these instructions?

--- End quote ---

Tks Kat for clarifying that the biblical church instructions were only for those called into Christianity.  I've often wondered how church discipline worked in the spiritual (episunagoge) church of God.

--- End quote ---

I've read somewhere on the forum that the bible is an instruction manual for the elect.. But you're saying the biblical instructions for church are only for those 'called'?

Am I misunderstanding?

Kat:

Hi largely,

Yes those early teachings concerning how to organize 'church' was soon dropped by the believers as their gatherings were so small as not to need those kind of instructions. But the huge false church that was to form from those beginnings ran with those ideas and built upon them until we have the "Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of the Harlots and of the Abominations of the Earth" (Rev 17:5) that we see today.

The Bible is written about the people that God has been dealing with throughout history, it's shows the plan of God being worked out. But in all the stories there are many parables. Everybody that reads the Bible can see the stories and they make out of it what they will, that is what the church does. People read the Bible and use human reasoning to explain it, that is where the church gets all of there doctrines.

Mat 15:9  But in vain do they worship me, Teaching as their doctrines the precepts of men.

Mat 13:12  For whosoever hath (the Holy Spirit indwelling), to him shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but whosoever hath not (the Holy Spirit indwelling), from him shall be taken away even that (truth) which he hath.
v. 13  Therefore speak I to them in parables; because seeing they see not, and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
v. 14  And unto them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall in no wise understand; And seeing ye shall see, and shall in no wise perceive: (words in blue in parentheses are my addition)

It is only through the Holy Spirit that anybody can understand the deeper spiritual meanings of the symbols contained within the stories of the Bible. So it is an instruction manual to the elect, the truth is there, but it is indeed a mystery.

Col 1:26  the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, but now has been revealed to His saints.
v. 27  To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

http://bible-truths.com/lake4.html ------------------------------------

 PARABLES ARE SPIRITUAL

What were those parables that Jesus taught? A parable is a story that contains in figurative or symbolic language a higher moral or spiritual truth. Parables are HIGHER, SPIRITUAL, GLORIOUS teachings of ETERNAL things. Literally they are of little consequence; spiritually they are of enormous consequence. But without knowing what the symbols represent in a parable, no one could ever understand the higher meaning. Therefore the multitudes of people did not understand the teaching of Jesus Christ, because He did not explain the meaning of the symbols to the masses, only to His disciples in private.

Many people have tried to tell me that parables are to be taken literally. What they don’t realize is that they are talking about square circles. The very reason a parable is called a parable is so that we will know for sure that whatever is contained in the parable IS NOT LITERAL. Parables require spiritual understanding. Some require little (albeit some) spiritual understanding. Example: The Parable of a Beam in One’s Eye. There are few believers who would not understand the meaning of this parable, although they might not practice its teaching. Others such as The Parable of the Prodigal Son requires much more spiritual understanding, as there are many more spiritual truths contained in this story. And probably the most complex of all parables is the parable of Lazarus and the Rich man. (See my fifty-page explanation of this parable on this site).

I remember seeing Charlie Brown cartoons many years ago that had two levels of humor written into them: One very simple and easy to follow for little children; and another higher more sophisticated level of humor to keep the adults entertained as well. Unfortunately all too many Christians can only view parables on the level of very little children viewing Charlie Brown cartoons. The higher meaning is totally missed, and/or not believed.

A simple example: "Another parable spoke He unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened." Jesus didn’t explain this parable, so what does it mean? Most certainly understand that leaven (like yeast) put into dough will cause the dough to rise through fermentation. But what is the spiritual application of this parable? Paul tells us that, "Know ye not that a little leaven leavens the whole lump" (I Cor. 5:6). But who believes this parable? According to Jesus, the kingdom of God is like this parable of the leaven and the lump. The kingdom of God moves and works throughout the entirety of the universe until the WHOLE of God’s creation is brought under its influence. But who believes it?

The time comes when Jesus Christ will turn over the kingdom of God to His Father: "Then comes the end, when He shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when He shall have put down all rule and all authority and power … that GOD MAY BE ALL IN ALL" (I Cor. 15:24 & 28b). Then the whole lump will be leavened with God! Everyone—ALL. This parable is not literal. The kingdom of God is not literally "leaven in a lump of dough! These teachings are SPIRITUAL! They teach GREAT SPIRITUAL TRUTHS! Every parable teaches a spiritual truth. Unless you understand the parable of the leaven and the dough, you don’t understand the gospel. Because the leaven in the dough is like the kingdom of God and Jesus came preaching the "GOSPEL" OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD! You see, if the leaven does NOT leaven the WHOLE lump, then it is NOT "like the kingdom of God." Anything that does not involve the whole (everyone) cannot be "like" the kingdom of God. For anything to be "like" the kingdom of God it must involve the whole, the all, everyone, all mankind. Therefore Jesus said that the kingdom of God is "like" leaven that leavens the WHOLE LUMP! Aren’t these little parables just MARVELOUS?
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mercy, peace and love
Kat

lareli:
Kat there's a lot of scripture concerning how to do church.. It's hard to accept that we can just decide that those parts don't apply. How is this different than people picking and choosing scriptures that make them feel good and dropping ones that they don't agree with?

You say that those teachings about how to do church were dropped early on.. Where did you get this information?

Kat:

Those were my observations from what I have read in Scripture and some historical accounts. If you can show me the Scriptures you are speaking of it would help to answer your question.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

lareli:
I know there's more but here's a few..



Hebrews 3:17

Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.

1 Peter 5:5

Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.

1 Tim 2:12

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

1 Tim 3

3 It is a trustworthy statement: if any man aspires to the office of [a]overseer, it is a fine work he desires to do. 2 An overseer, then, must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, prudent, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, 3 not addicted to wine [c]or pugnacious, but gentle, peaceable, free from the love of money. 4 He must be one who manages his own household well, keeping his children under control with all dignity 5 (but if a man does not know how to manage his own household, how will he take care of the church of God?), 6 and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation [d]incurred by the devil. 7 And he must have a good reputation with those outside the church, so that he will not fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

8 Deacons likewise must be men of dignity, not [e]double-tongued, [f]or addicted to much wine [g]or fond of sordid gain, 9 but holding to the mystery of the faith with a clear conscience. 10 These men must also first be tested; then let them serve as deacons if they are beyond reproach. 11 [h]Women must likewise be dignified, not malicious gossips, but temperate, faithful in all things. 12 Deacons must be husbands of only one wife, and good managers of their children and their own households. 13 For those who have served well as deacons obtain for themselves a [j]high standing and great confidence in the faith that is in Christ Jesus.

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