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What do you guys think about this.....Abortion !!
Extol:
--- Quote from: John9362 on July 22, 2014, 09:12:36 AM ---I was feeling numb and in shock, watching the numbers grow, every second a child is aborted.......about 3,600 in an hour world wide, every second, every hour, every day, month, year, it just doesn't stop ..................almost unbelievable !!
I see 298 people lose their lives in that horrible plane crash and see the world FREAKING out over the missile attack, my mind and heart wonder back to the abortion clock and the babies, I think to myself 'who cares for them' ??
298 people in a plane crash 4 days ago and during the same period over 300,000 abortions !!
Hard to take, my heart is so heavy !
--- End quote ---
One of my favorite verses since coming to this site is 1 Cor. 15:50: Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God. It has been a great help as far as coping with suffering and death. When I hear about a plane crash or tornado or abortions or just a co-worker's grandfather dying, it's one of the first things that pops into my head, every time: Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Of course, that's only half the story: the next thing that pops into my head is "They will live again." And that's an even greater source of comfort. Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, but one day God will be all in all--the aborted babies, the mothers, the killer doctors, the pro-life doctor killers--ALL in ALL. And of the increase of His government and peace there will be no end. . .
Kat:
I'm going to diverge on this subject a bit and ask the question, where does "life" begin, in the physical sense? This is an serious question that became a very hot topic in the abortion debate in the past and now... in searching the Scripture what can you find out about this?
Gen 2:7 And Jehovah God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Job 12:10 In whose hand is the life of every living thing, And the breath of all mankind?
Job 33:4 The Spirit of God has made me, And the breath of the Almighty gives me life.
Job 34:14 If He should set His heart on it, If He should gather to Himself His Spirit and His breath,
Psa 104:29 You hide Your face, they are troubled; You take away their breath, they die and return to their dust.
Isa 42:5 Thus says God the LORD, Who created the heavens and stretched them out, Who spread forth the earth and that which comes from it, Who gives breath to the people on it, And spirit to those who walk on it:
Eze 37:9 Also He said to me, "Prophesy to the breath, prophesy, son of man, and say to the breath, 'Thus says the Lord GOD: "Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these slain, that they may live."
v. 10 So I prophesied as He commanded me, and breath came into them, and they lived, and stood upon their feet, an exceedingly great army.
Acts 17:25 Nor is He worshiped with men's hands, as though He needed anything, since He gives to all life, breath, and all things.
Rev 11:11 Now after the three-and-a-half days the breath of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and great fear fell on those who saw them.
Okay I assume there will be a lot of raised eyebrows at what I am indicating here. Well to me in these Scripture there seems to be a very clear connection that the breath brings the spirit and life to a person. Could this possibly include all of those precious little babies that have not been born? There is a curious comment in Job.
Job 10:18 'Why then have You brought me out of the womb? Oh, that I had perished and no eye had seen me!
v. 19 I would have been as though I had not been. I would have been carried from the womb to the grave. (NKJV)
Job 10:19 I would have been just as if I had not come into being; I would have been fetched from the belly to the tomb. (CLV)
Job 10:19 as if I had never existed; carried from the womb to the grave. (ISV)
So what about the Scripture that speaks of God knowing somebody in the womb? God knows the end from the beginning and certainly He knows who He will bring into life or not. Does that make the death/abortion of these babies any less horrific, of course it does not.
Jer 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; Before you were born I sanctified you; I ordained you a prophet to the nations."
Consider another thing, if all these millions of aborted/stillborn babies would be raised at the resurrection, would God bring them all to full term so they could live outside of the womb as many miscarriages happen very early in pregnancy? Well of course He could... but then what would the beginning of the next age be, a giant nursery? It would need to be and it would be a full time job for most of the population to care for all these babies. Well that's not such a bad thing, but is there any indication in Scripture that's what the next age is about? We know the next age is for judgment.
Anyway this is a hard subject and our emotions get caught up in it. But this is what I have found in Scripture, there is much more to it, but I think I have said enough.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
Abednego:
How do you explain Luke 1:39-41?
At that time Mary got ready and hurried to a town in the hill country of Judea, where she entered Zechariah’s home and greeted Elizabeth. When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.
Kat:
--- Quote from: Abednego on July 22, 2014, 12:38:49 PM ---How do you explain Luke 1:39-41?
At that time Mary got ready and hurried to a town in the hill country of Judea, where she entered Zechariah’s home and greeted Elizabeth. When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.
--- End quote ---
Luke 1:41 And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.
Well how do you explain that... does a baby in the womb have knowledge of what is going on in the world? Interesting how it connected with her being "filled with the Holy Spirit."
mercy, peace and love
Kat
John from Kentucky:
Kat brings up an interesting point.
The Scriptures do indicate that a human becomes a living soul when breathe enters the body.
A baby in a mother lives off its mother's breathe and nutrients.
Also, in the Law of Moses, if a pregnant woman was struck and lost the child within her, then monetary compensation had to be paid to her husband.
If a living person was intentionally killed, then the killer was subject to the death penalty. Even if they clung to the altar of sacrifice, they were to be dragged out and executed.
If a living person were killed by accident, not intentionally, then the killer had to flee to one of the six cities of refuge, three on the east of the Jordan River and three on the west, in order to be protected from the deceased person's relatives.
But there was no provision in the Law for payment of monetary damages for the deceased. So that makes me wonder if an unborn child was considered a person, a living soul. Because if they were a living soul, then the punishment would have been death instead of the payment of monetary damages, if the unborn was killed intentionally.
I do not know the answer to when a human becomes a living soul. I believe God will have to answer that question in the age to come. Is it at birth or conception?
But right now, my opinion based upon my understanding of Scriptures, is that a human is a living soul only if they have breathed the breathe of life, at which time they become a living soul.
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