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Eph.4:9
dave:
I know Ray spoke somewhat on and about Eph. 4:8-16 but can anyone shed a word or two on Eph 4:9 and that, he went up, what is it except that he also went down first to the lower parts of the earth?
Just wondering about the bold part..... the lower parts of the earth. Thanks
Ian 155:
From God Judges the World in a Pond...subtitle"O God, Thy sea is so great and my boat is so small." + - 14th paragraph from the top,
"The "sea" in Scripture is a symbol for mankind, humanity—the sinning human race. Scripture often speaks of (1) the sea, (2) the earth, and (3) the heaven—the sea being the lowest, and the heaven being the highest".
My understanding of this scripture is ...
Christ was made man (Earth) experienced Earth and overcame Earth - there are various states of being earthly minded, Jesus descended to the lowest carnal (earthly) state before he ascended to the highest state which is Above the Heavens - The same process happens to us who are being saved.
Nathan:
--- Quote ---I know Ray spoke somewhat on and about Eph. 4:8-16 but can anyone shed a word or two on Eph 4:9 and that, he went up, what is it except that he also went down first to the lower parts of the earth?
Just wondering about the bold part..... the lower parts of the earth. Thanks
--- End quote ---
This is a parable:
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,1057.0.html ------
Jesus NEVER said that He would be "buried" for three days and three nights. He said He would be "In the heart of the earth" for three days and three nights. He did not say that he would be "buried" for that time, or even "dead" for that time. Remember this is "the sign of JONAH." WAS JONAH D-E-A-D?
Jesus did not say He would be DEAD for three days and three nights. Jesus did NOT say that He would be BURIED in a tomb for three days and three nights. You can say that if you want to, but you know that it is unscriptural. Jesus did not say that as Jonah was in the belly of the fish for three days and three nights, so He would also be in the belly of a fish for three days and three nights. You still don't get It's a PARABLE (Matt. 13:34)?
Are the three days and three nights of Jonah being compared with the three days and three nights of Jesus? NO! No, that is not the point of comparison. You are totally, totally missing it. Here is the point of comparison:
Jonah: "AS... Jonas was three days and three nights IN THE WHALE'S BELLY,
Jesus: SO... shall the Son of man be three days and three nights IN THE HEART OF THE EARTH."
There is your "comparison."
There is your "sign."
There is you "parable."
AS "in the whale's belly," SO "in the heart of the earth."
But you still don't know what this "parables" means, do you? For you have not a clue as to what "in the heart of the earth means."
You know as well as I (or maybe you don't, but now you do) that you need a SECOND WITNESS to establish any spiritual truth. I gave you that second witness, but you didn't even get it because you are still thinking carnal and physical and literal, and that kind of thinking will never explain a parable, as parables are only "SPIRITUALLY discerned."
The second Scripture that is a Second Witness to "heart of the earth" is "Now that He ascended [which He did], what is it but that He also descended first into the LOWER [DEPTH, LOWER, UNDER, LOWEST LEVEL, etc.] parts of the earth?" (Eph. 4:9). There it is. There is the second witness. But you still don't know what this parable is. The "heart [depth] of the earth" IS the parable.
Dave in Tenn:
Thanks, Nathan.
Ian, be very careful with that line of thinking. There are those so enamored with the 'doctrine' of Jesus having a 'carnal mind' or a 'sin nature' that they denigrate Him and the work He did FOR US. Ray had no tolerance for that, and neither will we.
"Yet without sin..." is a TRUE STATEMENT that can be applied to everything He did or said in the Gospels, Acts, and The Revelation. Besides, sometimes the 'earth' is just the earth. The definition of "spiritual" is NOT the definition of "symbolic".
dave:
Thanks Nathan for the link I was looking for.
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