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Is it possible to be Chosen of God without reading The Scriptures
Ian 155:
--- Quote from: largeli on October 20, 2014, 01:00:07 PM ---Ok. How about the man on the cross next to Jesus?
The question was is it possible for someone to be chosen of God without reading the scriptures..
The answer is yes. God can choose whomever He wants. He can choose someone from before the foundation of the world and determine that this chosen one would not even have access to a bible. How can anyone say that is not possible? How is that going outside of Gods parameters?
Scripture tells us which is more important, knowing the bible or doing what Christ commanded which is to love one another as ourselves. Romans also says that it's possible for those who are without the law (love God and love your neighbor as yourself) to do instinctively what the law commands (love God and love your neighbor as yourself)..
It is not the hearers or readers of the word who will be justified but the doers. Love your God and love your neighbor as yourself is the sum of all the commands. People can obey the one single command which sums up all commands without ever opening a bible. They can be chosen of God before the creation of the world to obey and be justified.
This is my understanding and I don't proclaim that my understanding is right or wrong. It's just the understanding that I have now.
--- End quote ---
I havnt followed this whole thread but - if you dont know the Law ,how can you do the things written therein and if you dont know what Jesus Says how can one do the things he Says ?
Paul writes that he does have knowledge even though he has trouble expressing it in words,and he does instruct us to study..
If you read any book for instance, you visualize the story in your heart/mind you may even relate to some of the words written.
That visualisation/interpretation can be wrong though and perhaps many months later in a discussion say,you may have a lightbulb moment where that which you read suddenly has a greater meaning - but you cant relate to this if its not stashed somewhere in ones memory (because of what you read)matt 13 v 52
Luk 9:44 Let these sayings sink down into your ears: for the Son of man shall be delivered into the hands of men. [/b]
Luk 9:45 But they understood not this saying, and it was hid from them, that they perceived it not: and they feared to ask him of that saying.
The disciples were not literally reading what Jesus was saying.... they were listening -
so I think i hear what you are asking Largely
I think one is compelled to read the word this compulsion is heightened when you understand it.... as far as "can one be chosen if one does not read the word"
(READ) ;) what Jesus said to the wife of Zebedee
Matt 20 v 20 - 23
many folk read and read and read and still have no clue - its not up to us
I suppose bible audios would be ok
lareli:
--- Quote from: Ian 155 on October 21, 2014, 12:20:22 AM ---
I havnt followed this whole thread but - if you dont know the Law ,how can you do the things written therein and if you dont know what Jesus Says how can one do the things he Says ?
--- End quote ---
God can do anything He wants. He can raise up children of Abraham from a stone if He wants. Its impossible for our finite minds to fully comprehend an infinite god.
Romans 2:14,16
14 For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them 16 on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.
Love your god and love your neighbors as yourself is the law that sums up all laws. Its the opposite of hypocrisy. Even those who never open a bible know what hypocrisy is and that its evil. Whether we obey our conscience when it convicts us of hypocrisy or not is another issue. But it is possible to be a doer of the word and obey the law of Christ and not ever study scripture.
Kat:
largely, you read from a passage where Paul is explaining that the physical Jews would not gain salvation by their keeping the laws physically. But the Gentiles never were allowed into the synagogues or Temple where the only Scripture were kept, yet they are capable of understanding the truth. They did not have Bibles to study at that time, they were learning from Paul's teaching. Those people at that time were taught about God and the truth through preaching, they learned through "hearing," not just because they had a the truth automatically.
James 1:22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
v. 23 For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror;
v. 24 for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was.
Do you really think that now when just about every person can easily own a Bible to read that they don't need that? In early times when there was no Bibles, they had to learn through preaching, but they learned the truth from somebody, it was not just an instinctual thing. Paul was sent to them to teach them the truth, just like anybody must learn it.
Acts 13:46 And Paul and Barnabas spoke out boldly, saying, "It was necessary that the word of God be spoken first to you. Since you thrust it aside and judge yourselves unworthy of eternal life, behold, we are turning to the Gentiles.
v. 47 For so the Lord has commanded us, saying, "'I have made you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring salvation to the ends of the earth.'"
v. 48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.
v. 49 And the word of the Lord was spreading throughout the whole region.
We are very blessed in this day to have so must available for us to study and learn from, look at the internet, a major means of knowledge increasing. All of this is a great aid to the elect to study and learn much, if God has chosen and inspired them to. To think otherwise is just making excuses.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
Ian 155:
mmmm OK - once again read Rom 7v7
What shall we say, then? Is the law sin? God forbid. But I do not know sin, but by the law; for I had not known concupiscence, if the law did not say: Thou shalt not covet.
lilitalienboi16:
Some people here simply refuse to hear and understand this matter despite the ample scriptures that have been shared: these Words of God, which state and admonish us to study the scriptures--To study the Word of God. There is a pattern to how God raises up those who will REIGN with Christ. Here are more witnesses to this testimony:
Proverbs 25:2 "It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter."
Matthew 13:44 "Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto treasure hid in a field; the which when a man hath found, he hideth, and for joy thereof goeth and selleth all that he hath, and buyeth that field."
There are people throwing around one verse here and there, sowing confusion among those less learned. We are told that in the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.
As for how people learned before we had the scriptures, how did people study? They had the words straight from those God had chosen to spread His gospel around the world. Kat explained this and I think she hit the nail on the head. After these men were departed, their works were preserved so that those who could not learn directly from them now had their words to study from.
You want to be a king? You want to be chosen of God and overcome? Then you need to SEARCH THE MATTER OUT:
You need to..."Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth" (2 Tim. 2:15) because "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." (2 Timothy 3:16-17).
While there is nothing we in ourselves can do to attain election, you have to understand that God has a pattern and way of doing things and those things are laid out for us in the scriptures. He does not change. If we were admonished two thousand years ago to study the Words, to search the matters out, to sell everything we have so we can buy that field, etc... then it is the same today as well.
Alex
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