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Is your faith challenged when you hear about UFO’s
Kat:
Hi Michael,
As I had posted the section where Ray spoke about the Genesis 1:26-27 as being the first time when God "made" male and female humans to live on earth, I believe this was long before Adam and Eve were "formed" (Genesis 2:6). So we have 2 separate times of man being created and I believe that the nations are the descendants of the first people of Genesis 1 that were already living at the time Adam was formed in Genesis 2. Though they certainly intermixed (Genesis 6:2), there was plenty of the first people that did not and lived as separate nations all the way down to new testaments times, I believe they were then referred to as Gentiles/foreigners/stranger/aliens, depending on the translation.
Actually Cain had left the land of his parents, Adam and Eve.
Gen 4:16 Then Cain went out from the presence of the LORD and dwelt in the land of Nod on the east of Eden.
So it is possible that not every single descendant of Adam was in the area of the flood. I think the flood, though certainly literal and did wipe out those descendants of Adam that were there in that part of the land. But it has great symbolism... the ark representing Christ and Noah and his family the few that are 'in' Christ, and the flood the judgment to come on the world.
The term "of their father, the devil" is also symbolic, of the carnal minded people being influenced by Satan. But the idea that Satan fathered Cain is just not a possibility to me. Here is one place Ray mentions this.
http://bible-truths.com/lake2.html -----------------------------
Is this really describing something physical?
[Ray's reply]
Satan is a spirit being, seeing that he has been around for thousands of years. He is called a devil, serpent/snake, dragon, etc. We are not exactly sure what a dragon looks like, but supposedly it is in the reptile family as are snakes.
Nowhere that I can think of, did Satan ever appear visibly to anyone. Therefore his serpent/dragon qualities (or lack thereof) must be spiritual. Satan is a SPIRITUAL SNAKE. He has the secret, stealth qualities of a snake moving unseen in the dark. Although he is "like" [in certain characteristics] a roaring lion, he is not a lion, but "as" a lion he goes about seeking whom he may devour [Gk: 'swallow up' as in 'swallow a camel']. Spiritually devour/swallow.
So, did Eve talk with a literal, physical, snake, face to face, in the garden? I don't think so.
God be with you all,
Ray
Dave in Tenn:
I'll bow out with this (hopefully--no promises). Genesis 6:4 is not it's own interpretation either. Jesus and the Apostles explained to my complete satisfaction just who the 'children of God' are. I'm at perfect peace with that, and see absolutely no reason to 'interpret' Genesis 6:4 in any other way. Wrestle all you want with genealogies and how they work. Cain didn't reference "giants". Not even Abraham was a "Jew". Not even Isaac was Jew. There are tons more people NOT mentioned in scripture either by name or 'nationality' than ARE. They all live(d) and moved(d) and have/had their being in Him. He has made all things, and without Him nothing that was made was made. Without Him--nothing.
lurquer:
Well, I guess the question of the true nature of the Flood still haunts me...Being a once hardened 'global flood' guy who knew all the scriptures inside and out regarding it... I absolutely understand it now as local; I am convinced of it scripturally and 'scientifically', but I'm still hung up on the very precise wording of the scripture as to "all that have the breath of life perished" (and so forth). It just seems like God went through a whole lot of trouble enacting the Flood, then inspiring the precise words about it to be recorded and remembered in almost every culture to this day, if He only meant to just wipe out a few evil people in a very small land, in order to make a (minor) spiritual point to a very small sect of His followers.
I just think there was something a bit more profound to it.
Anyway, Nathan, thanks for the response! I guess I should have used an emoticon or something though to show I was being a bit facetious.. I know Cain was literally not the 'spawn of Satan', and the Pharisees were likewise not the descendants of the Devil, or Nephilim, or ET. So I get that.. BUT, (and by 'Reptilians', I was just using the parlance of the herd!) I still see something fundamentally different with some people--actually a large minority of people I've been blessed/cursed with having the acquaintance of... many of whom were among my own family.
If you want to see it through my eyes, read The Mask of Sanity. There really is something different about some people. Something wholly intangible, which cannot be described with the tools of science, perhaps, but something nonetheless. It's not that they're "more evil than the sons of God", rather, something darker, obscure, something lacking..
Kat, I do see it your way as well. But, there is certainly something very much unexplored regarding the idea that we don't all share the same common ancestor! This is crypto-archaeology teetering on paranoid delusion! No sect of modern science (that I know of) even hints at this. And yet, what does that say about someone like me, who, possibly, believes it? Really, isn't that exactly what the "Reptilian" cult teaches? :o
Curious too...what percentage of humanity today, do you reckon, are actual descendants of Adam?
Kat:
--- Quote from: Neo on March 01, 2015, 08:44:14 PM ---Kat, I do see it your way as well. But, there is certainly something very much unexplored regarding the idea that we don't all share the same common ancestor! This is crypto-archaeology teetering on paranoid delusion! No sect of modern science (that I know of) even hints at this. And yet, what does that say about someone like me, who, possibly, believes it? Really, isn't that exactly what the "Reptilian" cult teaches? :o
Curious too...what percentage of humanity today, do you reckon, are actual descendants of Adam?
--- End quote ---
Well it's interesting that their are indigenous people all around the world, some that continue to live a tribal lifestyle. They have lived an unsophisticated lifestyle for tens of thousands of years, then there arose a more dominate people that began colonization and domestication of these people.
As you mentioned Michael, there is absolutely no acknowledgment that there are 2 separate groups of people from separate ancestors. I can only say that this seems to be just another bit lost knowledge that has completely deceived the world... like the idea that the flood was worldwide, that there is a eternal hell, that we have free will, etc.
Here is a little bit I found on the indigenous people... there are at least 370 million people worldwide are considered to be indigenous. Most of them live in remote areas of the world. Indigenous peoples are divided into at least 5000 peoples ranging from the forest peoples of the Amazon to the tribal peoples of India and from the Inuit of the Arctic to the Aborigines in Australia.
The indigenous population for the Untied States, as of 8/12/12 is about 0.9% indigenous, 0.7% part-indigenous.
Indigenous people made up 3% of the total Australian population, there are 670,000 of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in 2011.
I believe the world at the time of the Apostles understood these things as they truly were; about Adam and his descendants, the flood being local and the indigenous peoples as well. It seems the church has brought in so many terrible deceptions (intended, interesting that Scripture wording allows for that) to the world, so that over the centuries so much knowledge of these things has been totally lost.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
lurquer:
I wonder if anyone has tracked the population growth of the earth...indigenous people vs. 'societal' people vs. time. When did the sons of God overtake the aboriginal humans in magnitude? Something happened, historically speaking, when that occurred.
And what, exactly, makes the sons of God fundamentally different from the aboriginals? We still have them today;we know their 'habitat'. And they don't seem any more evil than 'Us'. Matter of fact, they seem more sociable, more in tune with Creation, and closer (in mind set) with the Creator.
'We' build nuclear weapons. 'We' treat our fellow men like animals to be controlled, corralled, and consumed.. 'We' are the destroyers of the earth.
"Cain slew Abel Seth knew not why..."
(the song writer continues),
"Lord no man is free
The temples that we built to you
Have tumbled into the sea"
It is obvious, our Line (If I am of it) is no better than theirs. We are indeed of "one blood". We have all been murderers and liars from the beginning.
So what makes God's sons (his new ancestral line through Adam) different?
Knowledge. Interestingly, I was just reminded of the notion of "episodic memory", and how it differentiates humans from all other animals (the ability to understand the past and the future; a determinant in the 'sense of self'). Also known as the knowledge of Good and Evil. I think it's entirely possible the early humans lacked episodic memory... a condition whose sufferers today we would call anterograde amnesiacs.
But, the primitive humans appear to have learned this knowledge by now, if not barely, by watching us... The fact that they cannot compete with us and our capacity for evil is only because they currently lack the resources...
We are truly, fundamentally, different though..WE are held to a higher standard, and will bear a higher penalty, because we, as sons, (either literal, or adopted) have been given KNOWLEDGE, which convicts us of our sin...
"If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin" (John 15:22)
That's us. Descendants of Adam. (And yes, for a very small group, He has given us a "cloak".)
Just wondering if anyone else sees it that way.
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