> Off Topic Discussions
How many people have ever lived on earth?
Kat:
Hi Joe,
I've wondered about this and so after a Scripture study I am convinced that 'life' starts when the spirit that God gives to all physical being, enters a person and all Scripture I found point to this being with the first breath.
Job 33:4 The Spirit of God has made me, And the breath of the Almighty gives me life.
Gen 2:7 And Jehovah God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Eze 37:9 Also He said to me, "Prophesy to the breath, prophesy, son of man, and say to the breath, 'Thus says the Lord GOD: "Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these slain, that they may live."
v. 10 So I prophesied as He commanded me, and breath came into them, and they lived, and stood upon their feet, an exceedingly great army.
Job 34:14 If He should set His heart on it, If He should gather to Himself His Spirit and His breath,
So When God breathed into him the breath of life, then he became a living soul (Gen 2:7).
There was a long discussion last year on this, here is the link.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,15769.msg141294/topicseen.html#msg141294
mercy, peace and love
Kat
lurquer:
Hi Kat,
Interesting topic you started! Much I've wondered on myself...
But now I find myself wondering on the topic you linked in your last post (the abortion thread). I didn't recall this thread, so I went and read it.
Just feel myself more lost in translation now... I don't claim to understand (and don't know of anyone else who does) when "life begins". BUT, if deliberately destroying a developing human in the womb is NOT killing (destroying a human life) as you contend, then it must be OK to harvest 'unwanted' fetuses for parts (same as if it was known that a concoction of excised plantar warts cured cancer). After all, in our fallen condition--let's face it--we need parts.
So do you agree with the abortion industry's practice (now exposed) of trafficking embryonic human parts for the benefit of the living? If so, then why not advocate--and champion!--the abortions of the 'unwanted' for the 'good of mankind'? They're not "human life" after all, so why not use their tissue rather than flush it? And if not, why not (per your theory)?
Once again, just curious...
Kat:
Neo, how dare you twist what I showed you in the Scripture as to my advocating abortion. You have a really bad habit of taking a subject down a rabbit hole. If you do not agree with what I showed you in God's Word... well some truths are not easy to accept, especially with what we hear broadcast day and night in this world.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
lilitalienboi16:
Neo,
Firstly I agree with Kat and the scriptures strongly declare through many witnesses that the breath of life is required for man to be ALIVE and become a LIVING soul.
Your use of the term 'fallen condition' is a red flag to me. Man has never ever been in a position to fall from nor did he ever fall from grace. We are exactly where God wants us to be. There was no 'fall.'
Alex
lurquer:
10-4, Kat and Alex. I agree with you both on the scriptures (teaching that with “the breath of life, man becomes a living soul). That wasn't my question.
Alex, you misunderstood my phrase of our “fallen condition”. I do not believe in the “Fall of Man”, in agreement with Ray’s teachings, of course. I merely meant our present condition of being made ‘weak’, dying, falling down, subject to death and decay… Things not in dispute here.
If Kat’s understanding that living things having human DNA are not yet human—if never able to take a breath, will never be human, not in this age or the ages to come—then what do we say about abortion? What is it then? Is it immoral? How can it be murder if they’re not even a “soul”? That makes a fetus less than an animal even, as animals are living souls.
SO, Kat, I’m not “twisting words”…I read your comments in the other thread where you stated your position that all of the unborn cannot be in the age to come because all of the Kingdom would then be just a “giant nursery”. Anyhow, since they never took a breath, they were never really part of the Family of God. IF your position is true (and I don’t know if you’re right or wrong), then how is abortion immoral, and how is the use of their bodies (“tissue”) for the good of the living anything other than a benefit to mankind? How do you reconcile this?
If it’s a Rabbit Hole, it’s one of your own making, because I’m just taking your belief to its logical conclusion. :-\
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