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Spiritual death
Jeff:
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on September 30, 2015, 10:06:12 AM ---
--- Quote from: Jeff on September 29, 2015, 09:28:49 PM ---So we can be spiritually alive and yet be carnal.
--- End quote ---
How else can we combat our carnality?
--- End quote ---
I don't know, but God is God.
judy:
This thread was very helpful. Sometimes no matter what I read I get scared I have just sinned beyond anything forgiveable, even though i know this isn't true, I suffer it. I then stay away from God because I don't want Him to look at me. Probably the worst sin is not believing all the time, all, all of it that we are still so carnal and we must be aware that at any moment we are so very capable of sinning. I am going to start every morning from now on remembering this, now when the temptation comes, I only hope and pray God allows me the grace to overcome. I am so hard on myself and no excuses do I allow but dear God, my life is so hard and I tend to focus too much on it. I need more gratitude, not thoughts of sorrow. God does not allow me to go to despair though. This really isn't something new, I have hung on by a thread before. I can do it again. This too shall pass. I must remind myself. Maybe, just maybe something wonderful will happen. I will think this thought. I have to. "as a man think, so shall it be"
Jeff:
Judy,
It was helpful for me too. I learned new Truth (new to me) and that's always a good thing. It's hard not to be ashamed of our sin when all we want is to "not" sin. But that's a good thing too. If you weren't aware of your sin, you probably wouldn't be aware of God either. Repenting is part of worshiping God, because He calls us to repent, and obedience is worship.
Peace,
Jeff
Dave in Tenn:
Colin: Just a side note. I'd never read II Corinthians 3 except in the King James. I took another look at it in other versions which were clearer, as well as the translation you quoted. That alone was 'inspiring' and fruitful.
John from Kentucky:
--- Quote from: Jeff on September 29, 2015, 07:18:22 PM ---
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on September 29, 2015, 04:20:36 PM ---
--- Quote from: Jeff on September 29, 2015, 03:50:36 PM ---Is this an accurate understanding?
1. Mankind has never been spiritually alive (save Christ) and will NOT be until Christ returns.
2. We can have an understanding of certain Spiritual Truths (per God's will) by His Spirit living within us (yet that doesn't make us spiritually alive - maybe just spiritually aware.)
3. We have no option but to sin, because of our spiritual weakness, but we are to repent, knowing that our sins are forgiven. This is the process of refining our carnal selves, through trials overcome, by God's grace and prompting, and love.
4. We do not have God's love, but He is "lov-ing" us in an ongoing process, which culminates with our becoming spiritually alive, at or after the Resurrection of the dead in Christ.
If this is true then we are not spiritually alive. No one is. Without God's love in us, we have no way of escaping carnality, we can only hope to have certain victories in our lives, as our refinement continues.
--- End quote ---
I would say not accurate.
The Elect are baptized with the Holy Spirit.
With this Spirit, God lives within us, in our innermost being, our heart.
We are then in constant communication with God. God's Spirit within us leads us to do the works of Jesus.
This Spirit gives us understanding of the Scriptures and Spiritual things. Without the Spirit, there is no understanding.
We have the down payment of the Spirit within us.
However, no one is truly born of the Spirit until the 1st Resurrection.
--- End quote ---
And yet we sin. We can't not sin. How can we be spiritually alive? Doesn't it mean "free from sin"? I believe that the elect are filled with Gods Spirit, but I don't find Scripture or Ray's teaching that tells us we're "alive". My understanding is that to be alive we need to not be sinning (sin is death.) It's an either/or. We all have varying degrees of inspiration from God's Holy Spirit, but we are still carnal, and spiritually dead.
A down payment is something promised in the future.
--- End quote ---
No, a down payment is in the present, not the future.
When you make a down payment on a house, you make a current payment. The balance is put off into the future.
For those Elect, who have God's Spirit in them, then they are spiritually alive now because the Spirit of God is LIFE itself. We have the earnest or down payment of the Spirit for we can do and understand spiritual things.
God does not condemn His begotten children, His Elect selected before creation. Jesus deals with us individually as the Great Shepherd Who looks over His lambs.
Of course, we still sin because we are not born again until the Resurrection of the Just at the 1st Resurrection, when we will be like the wind.
But we are special now. God watches over and protects His Elect, now at the present time. It will not go well for anyone to harm or bother God's Elect. As Mr. T would say, "I pity the fool".
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