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Author Topic: Qualifying factor.  (Read 1332 times)

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Rick

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Qualifying factor.
« on: July 28, 2016, 11:16:40 AM »

1 Timothy

[3] For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

[4] Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Knowing the fate of all people and understanding Gods plan for saving humanity I'm wondering if verse 4 is the qualifying factor for Gods elect in this aged where it says ( to come unto the knowledge of the truth )

We know many who believe in Christ who belongs to Christendom have not the truth.


God bless.







« Last Edit: July 28, 2016, 11:18:41 AM by Rick »
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Rick

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2016, 01:35:07 PM »

This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .

Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.

Your thoughts are welcomed.

God bless.

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cheekie3

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2016, 02:48:37 PM »

Rick -

This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .

Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.

Your thoughts are welcomed.

God bless.

I do not know how long you have known The Lord, but once you are dragged to Him by His Holy Spirit, and you know the Truth in your heart and mind - and you choose to want to know more of his knowledge of The Truth, He will impart this knowledge to you, at His Direction and Timelines.

His Truth, in this age, as you know is not for everybody.

His Elect, must choose each day to serve Him, and yearn for His Love and Truth, and Grace and Joy, and most of all His Peace.

I have had at least the following revealed to me, which I meditated on and when I knew it to be absolutely True, ate and drank it - having it engraved in my heart and mind by His Holy Spirit:

1. All is of God.
2. He Loves us.
3. He is in total Control of All Things at All Times.
4. We are not in charge of ourselves, He is.
5. He directs everyone's steps, even our thoughts.
6. We are to live as His Witnesses.
7. The Doctrines of the Catholic and Protestant churches are all false and in fact pagan.
8. The whole world is ruled by pagans.
9. We are in the world but not of the world.
10. We can only defeat evil by doing good.
11. We cannot make decisions for others, but we can influence them by how we live our daily lives.
12. Most people on the Earth are more comfortable lying than living in The Truth.

I am currently dealing with a massive Truth He has recently revealed to me; and what I am currently wrestling with, is the biggest challenge I have had yet - and until I have ascertained my status, I am not in a position to confirm the remedy.

It is all about your own heart and your desire to please Him at all times no matter what, that will lead you into the fullness of his knowledge of Truth.

Most people on the Earth have one or more issues that control their lives and keep them trampled underfoot - and they do not know the solution(s) to their problem(s) - but His Elect as The True Body of Christ have no superior but Christ Himself and Our Beloved Heavenly Father, and all the Elect's issues must be presented to Christ for resolution in the knowledge of His Absolute Truth.
 
I hope this helps you a little.

Kind Regards.

George
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lilitalienboi16

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2016, 04:14:00 PM »

This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .

Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.

Your thoughts are welcomed.

God bless.

Is it enough for what Rick? Is what enough? I'm not following.
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1 Cor 1:10 "Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."

Rick

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2016, 04:49:02 PM »

Hi George,

You started off by saying you don't know how long I've known the Lord , to be honest with you at one time I've would of answers my whole life.

Today I will only say I knew of Jesus just like all of Christendon knows of Jesus but they really don't know Him.

In that day they will say to Jesus did we not but Jesus will say get to my left. Not a direct quote as you know but there are many who claim to know God but really don't and there are many who claim to believe God but don't really believe the scriptures.

Believe it or not but this week I've come to terms with the sovereignty of God , it's been something I've struggled with for sometime as all my threads will testify to.

My whole life might boiled down to today I'm getting to know Jesus. Knowing Jeuse to me is knowing His word and His words are spirit and they are found in the Holy scriptures.

The scriptures speaks of having and accurate knowledge of God. To me a perfect accurate knowledge of God is knowing the sum of Gods word but to me once one is chosen they are chosen
I say only because I don't believe God chooses and un chooses His elect.

I hear some people say one can loose their salvation but I say did they ever have salvation. God knows the ends from the beginning so how could that be.

But all the things you mentioned I also believe but I should also say as I understand the sovereignty of God I realize it's the Potter who determines everything in a persons life as it really is He who directs our footsteps in the way He says we will go.

I think it's great to be able to ask questions and receive answers but even these things are dictated by God no matter how one views it.

But back to my original question how much knowledge of God does one need to know to qualify to be an elect .

God bless.
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Rick

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2016, 05:08:19 PM »

This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .

Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.

Your thoughts are welcomed.

God bless.

Is it enough for what Rick? Is what enough? I'm not following.


Hi Alex,


What I'm asking is how much knowledge is enough knowledge of God in this age to be and elect? The scriptures I put down that says God will have all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the God.

All of Christendon claims to know God and believes to be saved but if one does not have an accurate knowledge of God then how can one know God and if one does not know God then scripture says God will say depart from me I never knew you.

So again how much knowledge of God does one need to have that would qualify that one to be one of Gods elect, and yes I know this is Gods choice who will be the elect but that one would also have a accurate knowledge of God I'm thinking.

God bless.
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2016, 06:34:17 PM »

[3] For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

[4] Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

I think the first and primary "knowledge of the truth"" to be had is in the rest of the sentence/statement--"Good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who will have all men to be saved.

Is that enough "knowledge"?  What comes first? 
« Last Edit: July 28, 2016, 06:36:57 PM by Dave in Tenn »
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lilitalienboi16

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2016, 06:48:43 PM »

This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .

Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.

Your thoughts are welcomed.

God bless.

Is it enough for what Rick? Is what enough? I'm not following.


Hi Alex,


What I'm asking is how much knowledge is enough knowledge of God in this age to be and elect? The scriptures I put down that says God will have all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the God.

All of Christendon claims to know God and believes to be saved but if one does not have an accurate knowledge of God then how can one know God and if one does not know God then scripture says God will say depart from me I never knew you.

So again how much knowledge of God does one need to have that would qualify that one to be one of Gods elect, and yes I know this is Gods choice who will be the elect but that one would also have a accurate knowledge of God I'm thinking.

God bless.
Hi Rick,

I don't think knowledge is a main qualifying factor to being an elect. Knowledge doesn't save you, God does. God chooses and God justifies. Those with Christ are called, chosen, and faithful--THE ELECT.

Romans 8:32-34
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Yes, knowledge comes with being called and chosen and is a part of the process of salvation. You can't worship God in spirit and truth if you don't know the truth. That being said, remaining faithful is what will ultimately distinguish the elect from the rest. I believe God provides the knowledge sufficient for obedience without necessarily providing all those who obey with the same depth of knowledge.

Consider the differences between Paul, Peter who acknowledged there were difficult things in paul's writtings to understand, and John who was given the revelation of Jesus.

All had the true knowledge of God but perhaps to different depths.

Jesus said, why do you call me Lord (worship) and do not the things I say (obey)?

Obedience unto the end, remaining faithful, running the race to the finish line, those seeds that fall on the good ground and bring forth much fruit, etc.. is what will set those who are Christ's apart from those who are not.

You shall know them by their obedience! Not their knowledge ;)

John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the TRUE worshippers shall worship the Father IN SPIRIT and IN TRUTH: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

God bless,
Alex

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Dave in Tenn

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2016, 08:09:11 PM »

"Knowledge" used in this passage.

G1922
ἐπίγνωσις
epignōsis
ip-ig'-no-sis
From G1921; recognition, that is, (by implication) full discernment, acknowledgement: - (ac-) knowledge (-ing, -ment).

EPI-- a prefix that means higher or highest, more or most complete, ultimate.  It's the same prefix attached to "synagogue" to make the gathering "higher".

Compounded with  γνῶσις gnōsis gno'-sis which more simply means "knowledge". 

That's why many of my translations have it "full knowledge" rather just "knowledge".

I'm not going to preach after the "scripture-reading"  :)  I just wanted to dig a bit deeper into what Scripture actually says.   



 

 

 
« Last Edit: July 28, 2016, 08:29:01 PM by Dave in Tenn »
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Kat

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2016, 08:13:44 PM »


John 6:63  It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

Rom 8:9  But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

Rom 8:14  For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.
v. 15  For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, "Abba, Father."
v.16  The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,

Eph 1:13  In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

1Cor 6:19  Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?

Hi Rick, it is by the Spirit of Christ indwelling that sets a person apart as chosen... and that Spirit will prepare you ever, how long that takes, before your life ends to get you where God wants you. I do not think it's a question of knowledge so much as it is attitude of heart and a understanding of who God really is... because when you are completely unite with God at resurrection then you will have a direct link to the source of all knowledge.

So I really don't think we really can judge one another according to how much we know or have learned, maybe just learning to trust and obey God as the Spirit leads is most important. There have been times in history where it was illegal to own a Bible, punishable by death... but I certainly believe some degree of knowledge of the truth is necessary and God will make a way for that. Some are put in situation where they can study and gain much knowledge, others not so much.

Luke 12:48  ...And to whomsoever much is given, of him shall much be required: and to whom they commit much, of him will they ask the more.

mercy, peace and love
Kat
« Last Edit: July 29, 2016, 09:55:31 AM by Kat »
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Rick

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2016, 10:02:26 PM »

[3] For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

[4] Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

I think the first and primary "knowledge of the truth"" to be had is in the rest of the sentence/statement--"Good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who will have all men to be saved.

Is that enough "knowledge"?  What comes first?




Hi Dave,

Good reply ,

The main idea to me in that scripture is that God wills all men to be saved but I'm seeing the and come to a knowledge of God as a qualifier to the main idea.

So I'm thinking you can't have one without the other in this age only.

God bless.

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Rick

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2016, 11:06:10 PM »

Hi Alex and Kat,

Definitely great answers and from all I should say. But I want to say as all here who been apart of Christendom and have come to understand the deception that Christendon uses against those who are apart of Christendon by the truths Ray has taught has put all of us here who believe these truths on the right path with is exceptable to God.

I think both Alex and Kat are right in what they say. Dave you asked which is first, I feel compelled to say God is first.


God bless.
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Joel

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2016, 02:39:17 AM »

Jesus said;
John 14:6 -I am the way, the truth , and the life; no man comes to the Father, but by me.

How many people in the world knows that? If it is as they say, and about 30% of the world's population have some belief in the LORD JESUS CHRIST, and about 70% doesn't know very much about him, and the majority of that 70% even gives a tinker's damn about God the Father, and Jesus as Savior.

There has to be a big, big change for all men to be saved, and come to the knowledge of that TRUTH.

Joel
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cheekie3

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2016, 03:41:54 AM »

Rick -

Quote
But back to my original question how much knowledge of God does one need to know to qualify to be an elect .

Sorry, I missed that particular point.

You do not qualify to be His Elect, He chose His Elect before the foundation of Creation: His Choice, His Will, His Desire, and it has nothing to do with you.

Regarding knowledge, He gives you life at birth, then He drags you out of this world at a time of His Choosing. The knowledge for you to accept Him when He drags you, may differ from each Member of His Elect, but it must be sufficient for you to agree to follow Him from that day forward no matter what. He Graces you and provides you with The Faith of His Beloved Son to walk the path of one of His Elect.

Remember, there are four (4) categories of men and women who are approached by Our Heavenly Father, and only one category is prepared to give up all and follow Him.

You personally can check you current standing and status, by reflecting where you were and what you did, and where you are now and what you now do, and no longer desire to do some of the things you used to do, as He has cleansed you from the inside to become free of the tangles of this world.

His Word always checks your current state, if you are prepared to be fully examined by His Beloved Word.

I always check, and ask Him to check me, and if if there is anything in me that is an abomination and offensive to Him, I ask that He burn it out of me and purify me like pure silver and gold.

He continually develops you permanently into The Image of His Beloved Son, and this is irreversible, as once you digest and drink and eat any aspect of His Word, it becomes a part of you for good.

His knowledge to you shall and must increase daily and you grow in Him, more and more into His Devine Image.

To me, there are two paramount principles, once you are dragged from this world to Him:

1. You are daily being cleansed and purified through tribulations and much suffering for His Name's Sake.
2. You are a daily Living Sacrifice presented to the world as His Ambassador representing Him in this corrupt world system, so you shine out from those who are spiritually dead in their sins.

I hope this helps a little.

Cry Out to Him "Please Keep You Knowledge of Your Truth Coming, and do not ever stop, as I want to be Presented Pure and Holy to You in Your Presence, having been Purified in Your Holy Fire, which is Your Holy Word that cannot ever be Broken".

Kind Regards.

George


 
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Rick

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Re: Qualifying factor.
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2016, 12:50:49 PM »

"Knowledge" used in this passage.

G1922
ἐπίγνωσις
epignōsis
ip-ig'-no-sis
From G1921; recognition, that is, (by implication) full discernment, acknowledgement: - (ac-) knowledge (-ing, -ment).

EPI-- a prefix that means higher or highest, more or most complete, ultimate.  It's the same prefix attached to "synagogue" to make the gathering "higher".

Compounded with  γνῶσις gnōsis gno'-sis which more simply means "knowledge". 

That's why many of my translations have it "full knowledge" rather just "knowledge".

I'm not going to preach after the "scripture-reading"  :)  I just wanted to dig a bit deeper into what Scripture actually says.   



 

 

 


Thanks Dave and God bless.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2016, 01:40:20 PM by Rick »
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