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Qualifying factor.
rick:
--- Quote from: lilitalienboi16 on July 28, 2016, 04:14:00 PM ---
--- Quote from: Rick on July 28, 2016, 01:35:07 PM ---This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .
Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.
Your thoughts are welcomed.
God bless.
--- End quote ---
Is it enough for what Rick? Is what enough? I'm not following.
--- End quote ---
Hi Alex,
What I'm asking is how much knowledge is enough knowledge of God in this age to be and elect? The scriptures I put down that says God will have all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the God.
All of Christendon claims to know God and believes to be saved but if one does not have an accurate knowledge of God then how can one know God and if one does not know God then scripture says God will say depart from me I never knew you.
So again how much knowledge of God does one need to have that would qualify that one to be one of Gods elect, and yes I know this is Gods choice who will be the elect but that one would also have a accurate knowledge of God I'm thinking.
God bless.
Dave in Tenn:
[3] For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
[4] Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
I think the first and primary "knowledge of the truth"" to be had is in the rest of the sentence/statement--"Good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who will have all men to be saved.
Is that enough "knowledge"? What comes first?
lilitalienboi16:
--- Quote from: Rick on July 28, 2016, 05:08:19 PM ---
--- Quote from: lilitalienboi16 on July 28, 2016, 04:14:00 PM ---
--- Quote from: Rick on July 28, 2016, 01:35:07 PM ---This knowledge spoken of in verse 4 doesn't suggest how much of and accurate knowledge is required .
Is it enough to know the plan of God and His purpose for creating the human race ? How He is saving all in there order.
Your thoughts are welcomed.
God bless.
--- End quote ---
Is it enough for what Rick? Is what enough? I'm not following.
--- End quote ---
Hi Alex,
What I'm asking is how much knowledge is enough knowledge of God in this age to be and elect? The scriptures I put down that says God will have all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the God.
All of Christendon claims to know God and believes to be saved but if one does not have an accurate knowledge of God then how can one know God and if one does not know God then scripture says God will say depart from me I never knew you.
So again how much knowledge of God does one need to have that would qualify that one to be one of Gods elect, and yes I know this is Gods choice who will be the elect but that one would also have a accurate knowledge of God I'm thinking.
God bless.
--- End quote ---
Hi Rick,
I don't think knowledge is a main qualifying factor to being an elect. Knowledge doesn't save you, God does. God chooses and God justifies. Those with Christ are called, chosen, and faithful--THE ELECT.
Romans 8:32-34
33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
Yes, knowledge comes with being called and chosen and is a part of the process of salvation. You can't worship God in spirit and truth if you don't know the truth. That being said, remaining faithful is what will ultimately distinguish the elect from the rest. I believe God provides the knowledge sufficient for obedience without necessarily providing all those who obey with the same depth of knowledge.
Consider the differences between Paul, Peter who acknowledged there were difficult things in paul's writtings to understand, and John who was given the revelation of Jesus.
All had the true knowledge of God but perhaps to different depths.
Jesus said, why do you call me Lord (worship) and do not the things I say (obey)?
Obedience unto the end, remaining faithful, running the race to the finish line, those seeds that fall on the good ground and bring forth much fruit, etc.. is what will set those who are Christ's apart from those who are not.
You shall know them by their obedience! Not their knowledge ;)
John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the TRUE worshippers shall worship the Father IN SPIRIT and IN TRUTH: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
God bless,
Alex
Dave in Tenn:
"Knowledge" used in this passage.
G1922
ἐπίγνωσις
epignōsis
ip-ig'-no-sis
From G1921; recognition, that is, (by implication) full discernment, acknowledgement: - (ac-) knowledge (-ing, -ment).
EPI-- a prefix that means higher or highest, more or most complete, ultimate. It's the same prefix attached to "synagogue" to make the gathering "higher".
Compounded with γνῶσις gnōsis gno'-sis which more simply means "knowledge".
That's why many of my translations have it "full knowledge" rather just "knowledge".
I'm not going to preach after the "scripture-reading" :) I just wanted to dig a bit deeper into what Scripture actually says.
Kat:
John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
Rom 8:9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.
v. 15 For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, "Abba, Father."
v.16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
1Cor 6:19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?
Hi Rick, it is by the Spirit of Christ indwelling that sets a person apart as chosen... and that Spirit will prepare you ever, how long that takes, before your life ends to get you where God wants you. I do not think it's a question of knowledge so much as it is attitude of heart and a understanding of who God really is... because when you are completely unite with God at resurrection then you will have a direct link to the source of all knowledge.
So I really don't think we really can judge one another according to how much we know or have learned, maybe just learning to trust and obey God as the Spirit leads is most important. There have been times in history where it was illegal to own a Bible, punishable by death... but I certainly believe some degree of knowledge of the truth is necessary and God will make a way for that. Some are put in situation where they can study and gain much knowledge, others not so much.
Luke 12:48 ...And to whomsoever much is given, of him shall much be required: and to whom they commit much, of him will they ask the more.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
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