largeli -
You raise a very interesting question:
When Paul writes in Romans 1 about Gods wrath being revealed to "those" is he talking about religious people or pagans/atheists? I'll underline the parts that make me wonder if he was talking about religious people/ Christians..
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.
24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.
28 Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31 they have no understanding, no fidelity, no love, no mercy. 32 Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.
I used to read verse 20 and conclude that this was talking about atheists who don't believe there's a creator. But now I read and see that these people,
1. Suppress the truth. Which leads me to believe they had the truth.
2. What may be known about God is plain to them.
3. They knew God
4. Exchanged the glory of the immortal God and they exchanged the truth about God. Which would seem they had to first possess it before they could exchange it.
5. They did not retain the knowledge of God. Again indicating they possessed the knowledge at one time.
6. They know Gods righteous decree.
Is this a prophecy from Paul which spans all generations even today's religious conditions? What about verses 24-27? We all know that religious people in positions of authority sometimes commit perverted acts but I don't see it as being as rampant as Paul describes.. so perhaps this particular part (v24-27)is talking about something more specific that was happening in Rome and not part of a prophecy for all generations?
Any thoughts would be appreciated.
Thanks guys.
Is His Word for everyone or those He Called and Chose?
Does not Romans 1:18-32 (KJV) state that it is
those who show the opposite of the Fruit of His Spirit that this refers to (which includes all religions, beliefs, atheists, and all mankind except those that obey His Word) as He has declared that His Creation is all the proof that they need to acknowledge Him?
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 because that which may be known of God is manifest in them;
for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 and changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 and likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29
being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32 who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
Romans 5:9 (KJV):
Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Ephesians 5:6 (KJV):
Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Colossians 3:6 (KJV):
for which things’ sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
Revelation 11:18 (KJV):
And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
Revelation 16:19 (KJV):
And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
Warmest Regards.
George