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[Craig]

Ray,

    I enjoy your writings.  I have been studying you writings for several months.  Trying the Spirits if you will.  I love the way you use scripture after scripture.

    In  installment 16 part C of the lake of fire series section "Satan's Trinity of Man" you condemn the idea of the Body, Soul, and Spirit being 3 separate things.  In all of your writings it seems that you feel that the flesh and soul are the same in which you have a lot of convincing scripture.   Please explain 2 Thess 5:23 where the body, soul, and spirit are listed separately as 3 separate things.  Also in Heb 4:12 the joints and marrow (flesh) soul and spirit are divided by the sword of the of the word of God.

    Thanks
    Walan

    Dear Waylan:

    It is true that we all speak of "THE soul" as if there is a separate entity inside of our body that is called "the soul."  Not true. Without the spirit there is NO SOUL. Without the body there is NO SOUL.  Take a blue piece if transparent plastic or cellophane. Place it half way over a same size piece of yellow cellophane. You will have blue on one side, yellow on the other, and GREEN in the middle. The blue is the body, the yellow is the spirit, and the GREEN IS THE SOUL.  Notice that there is NO SOUL without the blue body and the yellow spirit. Separate the blue and yellow cellophane and the GREEN soul disappears. This is exactly how the human soul must be combined with a body and spirit, or IT DOES NOT EVEN EXIST. They are very closely related and appear to overlap, but there are distinction between soul and spirit. Understood?  Good.

    God be with you,

    Ray

[Falconn003]

Why oh why is the soul so hard to grasp an idea...

Leave it to the secular churches to mess this fomula up indeed.

Rodger

[Craig]

Ray,

Thanks for your response,

I do understand the analogy but this analogy does not explain why the body, soul and spirit are broken out into 3 different entities in the scriptures mentioned.  Please don't misunderstand me.  I am not trying to be argumentative at all.   In fact, I think that God is opening my eyes to a lot of false teachings (idols of the heart) that I have held to my whole life.  But these are the only verses that seem to contradict any of your teachings. These verses seem contradict the "flesh & soul being 1" concept.  I notice in your writings that you go to great lengths to give at least 2 scriptural witness to everything you teach.  Here are two witnesses that seem to say that the body, soul, and spirit are separate entities.  I'm sure that I am not the first to bring this up.  Please if you could commit on these verses.

Waylan
You have to get out of out if your head the idea that the spirit soul and body are "separate entities" as if they could function independently of each other.  Remember my TV analogy of six years ago?  The console is the body, the picture is the soul, and the electricity is the spirit. Yes, they are "entities," if you will that have distinct names, and functions, but none of them produces anything independent of each other. Smash the console and you have not soul (picture). Pull the plug and you have not soul (picture).  
Likewise remove the spirit, and the body dies. Remove the spirit and the soul disappears. Smash the body and the soul disappears. The soul IS THE SENTIENT man. The emotional, thinking, conscious man. This consciousness is called "soul."  It is not a thing that can literally travel or go somewhere independent of the body and brain. That is why it is said in the Greek Scriptures that at death the soul goes to hades. Hades means the unseen, the emperceptible, unconsciousness.
It take spirit from God in a body to give it live, which life is then called "a LIVING SOUL."
It tkes a little meditation to understand these concepts.

God be with you,
Ray

[love_magnified]

That's a pretty darn clear explanation.

[Sorin]

That's a pretty darn clear explanation.

I second that.

[sunset_drama_king]

Very good explanation given by Ray.

- Brett

[Harryfeat]

While reading this post I got the distinct visual impression of man being like a computer with only RAM memory.  The hardware is the body, the RAM is the soul and the electrical power is the Spirit.  The RAM or Soul exists only so long as there is a power supply.  Once that power or Spirit  leaves, all memory disappears. Obviously, there is no place where it goes, it just ceases to exist.

The hardest part of all this for me to get my arms around is the judgement.  If we lose all our memory when the soul dies with our body, do we wake again with a clean slate or is our past memory somehow reinstated.  

If we have a clean slate then how do we recognize what we are being punished or chastened for. Is it written in the book/list somehow like mentioned in Revelations?

I know this probably seems silly to most, but its what popped into my head while pondering this concept of soul.

feat

[Sorin]

Harry,


I think that in the Resurrection, since God is bringing the dead ( soul ) back to life,  that He will also restore our ( past) memories.

How else would we know what we are being punished for?

It's like plugging a computer back in to the power outlet, it comes back to life
and it still has all the memory saved. it didn't lose any information.

That's how it must be when God will Resurrect us from the dead, with all our past memories of sins intact.

I hope this helps, makes sense, etc...   :lol:

[Kevin]

Makes perfect sense to me Sorin

[YellowStone]

I think you are right also Sorin.

Kind of makes no sense to be randomly picked out of the crowd and thrown into the Lake of Fire and having no idea why.

[Falconn003]

Sorin

You hit the nail right on with this post of your.


How can it not be seen but this way, is beyond me.

Rodger

[Harryfeat]

Sorin

You hit the nail right on with this post of your.


How can it not be seen but this way, is beyond me.

Rodger

Hello Rodger,

Here is how I imagined with my carnal mind that it could  be seen another way.

My initial thoughts too, were that we would probably get back the soul/memories we had before we died.  However, are we to get a brand new "computer"/body that is not coporeal and has no carnal mind?  If the body is different, does that also mean the soul will be different?  Our old computers are not going to just be plugged in it would seem.  Perhaps at judgement all our faults are read to us from the" book of life" as part of the chastening process and the lake of fire.




Rev 17:8  The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to rise from the bottomless pit and go to destruction. And the dwellers on earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will marvel to see the beast, because it was and is not and is to come.


Sure its possible that all our old carnal memories might  be reinstalled in a soul that might no longer be carnal.  

Anyway, as I said earlier, this was just something that popped into my head while contemplating the soul.

feat

[eutychus]

remembering? good memories? bad memories, sin? etc.

Pro 31:7 Let him drink, and forget his poverty, and remember his misery no more.

 Hbr 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.


Hbr 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Psa 22:27 All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the LORD: and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee.


   if works can be said to be memories wont the bad ones be burnt away?


Psa 77:11 I will remember the works of the LORD: surely I will remember thy wonders of old.


lots to think about, good thread


time for a new harddrive


and these:

Eze 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:



2nd witness

Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.



3rd

Rev 2:17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth [it].

[Falconn003]

a

[Steve Crook]

This may seem to way out there on the scale of crazy questions, but if folks saw Christ in many different forms after he ressurreced, and they did see him according to their accounts (fisherman is good example), then why do we think Christ couldn't possibly appear today as a various person from time to time. Is, Was, and Will be.

I guess I'm saying that I don't rule it out as a possibility. However, I don't think that unless Christ revealed himself as being Christ, that anyone would know it was Christ, just as though his disciples literally walked and talked with the man and didn't even know him.

I know the new bodies we receive, if like Christ's, will have the ability to transcend material objects and shape themselves into whatever we will need them for. Pretty cool stuff, though our Father's Will will at that point be the only thng we use to do anything

It will all be great! NO more pain, suffering, bondage, etc., etc.

God bless