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Author Topic: I would like help.............,  (Read 1659 times)

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PKnowler

  • Guest
I would like help.............,
« on: December 01, 2006, 02:43:30 PM »

I would like for help in answering this question. I have become weary of debating.

Question:
If everyone went their seperate ways and ended up at the same place, then what is the point of being crucified? We could have all gone to hell just for a while, done our time, and bounced back to heaven.. voila! End of the story! No need for crucifiction. Death would have been taken care of in Christ's second coming.. and that's that.

Thanks, Paula

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MG

  • Guest
Re: I would like help.............,
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2006, 04:20:23 PM »

Here are some scriptures that might help until others reply.

1 Corinthians 15:20-22
20But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

Romans 6:4-6
4We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.
5If we have been united with him like this in his death, we will certainly also be united with him in his resurrection. 6For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin—

Hebrews 9
Worship in the Earthly Tabernacle
 1Now the first covenant had regulations for worship and also an earthly sanctuary. 2A tabernacle was set up. In its first room were the lampstand, the table and the consecrated bread; this was called the Holy Place. 3Behind the second curtain was a room called the Most Holy Place, 4which had the golden altar of incense and the gold-covered ark of the covenant. This ark contained the gold jar of manna, Aaron's staff that had budded, and the stone tablets of the covenant. 5Above the ark were the cherubim of the Glory, overshadowing the atonement cover.[a] But we cannot discuss these things in detail now.
 6When everything had been arranged like this, the priests entered regularly into the outer room to carry on their ministry. 7But only the high priest entered the inner room, and that only once a year, and never without blood, which he offered for himself and for the sins the people had committed in ignorance. 8The Holy Spirit was showing by this that the way into the Most Holy Place had not yet been disclosed as long as the first tabernacle was still standing. 9This is an illustration for the present time, indicating that the gifts and sacrifices being offered were not able to clear the conscience of the worshiper. 10They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings—external regulations applying until the time of the new order.

The Blood of Christ
 11When Christ came as high priest of the good things that are already here,he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not man-made, that is to say, not a part of this creation. 12He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, having obtained eternal redemption. 13The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean. 14How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death,[c] so that we may serve the living God!
 15For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

 16In the case of a will,[d] it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, 17because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while the one who made it is living. 18This is why even the first covenant was not put into effect without blood. 19When Moses had proclaimed every commandment of the law to all the people, he took the blood of calves, together with water, scarlet wool and branches of hyssop, and sprinkled the scroll and all the people. 20He said, "This is the blood of the covenant, which God has commanded you to keep."[e] 21In the same way, he sprinkled with the blood both the tabernacle and everything used in its ceremonies. 22In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.

 23It was necessary, then, for the copies of the heavenly things to be purified with these sacrifices, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24For Christ did not enter a man-made sanctuary that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God's presence. 25Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2006, 04:21:02 PM by MG »
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WildOlive

  • Guest
Re: I would like help.............,
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2006, 04:29:27 PM »

That would not be the end of the story.  Each one of us would be proud of our own work.  “Look at what I did.”  God’s plan gives Him all of the glory, this is where it belongs.
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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: I would like help.............,
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2006, 06:20:47 PM »

Hi Paula

Before answering your question I did a quick search on your profile and read all the posts you have written on the Forum. I was moved and touched to see how our Lord is gently leading you and blessing you.

Your question, I believe you are able to understand, is a question that the mind asks and answers for itself. After reading about all the wisdom that you have been gifted to recieve from the Lord by reading your posts, I believe you will easily see that it is the mind that answers rationally and logically and it is the mind that can not grasp the mystery of God that is given to be understood only by the Spirit of God. No one can make anyone see anything unless it is first ordained by God. Only God can set us free and it is only God who has thus far given you your eyes to see and ears to hear what you have seen and heard so far and as you have so beautifully expressed in your posts.

I have no doubt that He will continue to lead, bless and show you the way.

You comment : If everyone went their seperate ways ...for me this is not even a question because no one is going their sperate ways outside God's plan and intention for anyone.

Eph 1 : 11  In Him we also were made God's heritage and we obtained an inheritance; for we had been foreordained, chosen and appointed beforehand in accordance with His purpose, Who works out everything in agreement with the counsel and design of His own will. .....(He works out everything....everything in agreement with His own will...)  so no need to imagine, believe or even consider all the if's and buts.....

It is good to see from this that ifs and buts could very well be side streets that lead away from truth into speculation and gratification of the carnal mind. This is something that has been brought to light for me through your post and it has blessed me!

Peace be to you sister and His light continue with you as the lamp at your feet and light on your path. (Beautiful scriptures MG :))

Arcturus  :)
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PKnowler

  • Guest
Re: I would like help.............,
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2006, 08:19:47 PM »

I want to thank you MG, WildOlive and Arcturus for replying to my post. I hope you understand I wasn't asking this question. I have been debating with someone on carm and they asked. I guess the debating has gone on so long that I got weary and maybe lazy. So I thought I would use someone elses brain for a minute- ha ha. Am I bad? I didn't think it was a complicated question. I thought it was an important question that needed answered. I really just didn't have the strength to go on. It hasn't helped that I have been fasting for the last 3 days (not for spiritual reasons-per say).

Well I finally did muster up the strength to answer the question -thanks to your replies.

Anyways, Thanks again! Thank you for your kind words, Arcturus, it encouraged me.

Blessings, Paula

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