> General Discussions
Question on Sharing UR
iris:
I agree, this has been an awesome thread.
It has given me a lot to think about and to look deeper into myself.
Thanks Paula.
Iris
PKnowler:
Hi Anne,
I finally have some time to go through and reply to some of the post here. I really appreciate you taking the time to go through my questions and give a reply.
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- 1. "Do you think we should share our revelation of Universal Salvation with others." - Yes for the simple fact of the Great Commission. It exhorts us to go to all ends of the world with the Good News. Now what is the Good News? That would be John 3:16.
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That so resonates with my spirit! It fills me with JOY! What a privilege we have to share the GOOD NEWS! Why would we want to contain it? Amen!
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- 2. "Do you think that we should boldly proclaim it? - Do you know where Paul is talking about how he is boldly proclaiming the good news? I am sure it is in one of the epistles but the gist goes something like this, "Therefore brethern exhort[or encourage] one another as long as it is called Today." [AGAIN - I apologize for messing this Scripture up, if I have.] What better way to encourage each other and others than boldly proclaiming the Good News.
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It is by the Holy Spirit that we have such Boldness to speak forth His Word! It is a confidence and assurance of what God says is true. It is also wonderful to be with like minded believers to encourage one another in the faith by boldly proclaiming the Good News.
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- 3. "Or should we keep it to ourselves." - Jesus did not keep salvation to himself. It was for all men. There is a Scripture that says - God is not willing that any man should perish but that all men might come to be saved and to know him. No we should not keep it to ourselves. Universal salvation is for everyone. Universal - in the essence of the words demands to be shared with everyone.
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I didn't mean for us to keep the gospel to ourselves. What I meant was not make an issue of UR with our Christian friends. I am not opposed to sharing. I was just wondering if we knew that it would offend someone and they were not receptive if we should proceed in telling them. I do not desire to keep it to myself. I want to tell everyone but I want to use discretion and not push people away with a message they are not ready to hear. Does that make sense? Yes Universal Salvation is for everyone! Praise God! I trust the Lord WILL lead me in these situations.
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- 4. "Should we only share with Christains so we do not make non-Christains and fell no need for Christ." - All mankind feel a drawing to a higher power in this case God. God has predestined all of us to come to know him. Everything that happens is in his perfect and holy will. The bible says that nothing can thwart the will of God. Yes we need to share with these people. God uses all circumstances and all words to his purpose. We will not be able to discern all his purpose, but he knows.
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You are right. I realize my lack of faith by asking this question It is hard to shake this "I'm in control type" thinking sometimes. God is in control! It is all about His purpose and plan and nothing I say is going to thwart His Plan. It is God that does the drawing. God has given us the privilege of being co- laborers with Christ. Sometimes we just scatter seeds and we never know what might grow. Isn't that wonderful!
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- 5. There is a Scripture that says that he comes not in peace but to divide or with a sword. Mothers against Fathers. Parents against children. No matter what happens, all will come together in the end. We are not commanded to understand this fully, we are commanded and exhorted to spread the good News. Ray is an awesome example of spreading the Truth no matter the opposition. He has faced so much trouble from the people that are so entrenched in Babylon, yet he still stands up for the truth. That is what God tells us to do.
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Yes we will face opposition and we may lose friends and respect of family that is part of our walk. I understand we must stand for truth irregardless! But we should respect where someone else is in their walk- remembering were we came from.
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- So more points to add to this. Remember when Jesus was telling his disciples when they would come into questioning about their faith, he said that the Holy Spirit would prompt them as to what they should say. Jesus does not change and will not change. When we are witnessing the good news we need to let the Holy Spirit prompt us and be careful that we do no let our own emotions and agenda get in the way. If you are going to share the Good News, say a prayer that the words that Jesus wants to be shared with that person, will come out of your mouth and nothing more and nothing less. Nothing can go wrong this way. Sure you may face opposition, but remember the opposition that Jesus faced when he preaching the Good News. He faced death, but in the end to a glorious purpose, and truth triumphed. It looked like the end of the world before the end came.
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This is the bottom line. I need to trust that God will guide me in ALL situations! And I believe he will. Thanks for reminding me of the obvious!
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- A song that I reminded of I want to share.
"I'm pressed but not persecuted.
Struck down but not destroyed.
I am blessed beyond the curse
for his promises endure
His joy is gonna be my strength,
Tho sorrows may last for the night
Joy comes in the morning.
I'm trading my sorrow
I'm trading my pain,
I'm laying them down for the joy of the Lord."
And what is the joy of Lord? The Good News.
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Amen Sister you sing it! Yes the Good News! awh now I can rest. Amen- He has done it all. He loves us and will not leave us. We can trust that He will lead us and show us what to do, where to go and what to say. Hey that reminds me of another song.., naw it's late.
--- Quote from: rrammfcitktturjsp on December 21, 2006, 09:48:56 PM --- Share and share and share. I read somewhere else in another thread, it is NOT us who bring people to the Father, it is Christ and the Holy Spirit that brings them to the Father. We are merely tools that accomplsih this purpose. And what an honor this is.
I hope this helps.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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I need to remember that it is not me it is Christ. Thanks for reminding me! Yes we must share and scatter the seeds.
Thank you Anne for sharing your thoughts with me on this. You have blessed me and given me insight and wisdom.
Bless you sister,
Paula
andrevan:
Hi Paula.
Thanks for raising this interesting question, it is often on my mind. For me personally, I am always aware of the ministry given to us, the ministry of (universal) reconciliation. With the message of reconciliation comes the message of the Cross.
2Co 5:14 for the love of the Christ doth constrain us, having judged thus: that if one for all died, then the whole died,
2Co 5:15 and for all he died, that those living, no more to themselves may live, but to him who died for them, and was raised again.
2Co 5:16 So that we henceforth have known no one according to the flesh, and even if we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know him no more;
2Co 5:17 so that if any one is in Christ-- he is a new creature; the old things did pass away, lo, become new have the all things.
2Co 5:18 And the all things are of God, who reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and did give to us the ministration of the reconciliation,
2Co 5:19 how that God was in Christ--a world reconciling to Himself, not reckoning to them their trespasses; and having put in us the word of the reconciliation,
2Co 5:20 in behalf of Christ, then, we are ambassadors, as if God were calling through us, we beseech, in behalf of Christ, `Be ye reconciled to God;'
2Co 5:21 for him who did not know sin, in our behalf He did make sin [offering], that we may become the righteousness of God in him.
[YLT]
See also Colossians 1:20-21, Romans 5:10, Ephesians 2:15-16 for a few more reconciliation verses.
If/when we share this message of UR, then for me, the above verses can be used to make known the Gospel of Jesus Christ. How I see it: In these verses we have what Jesus is: a sin offering, what He did; reconcile the world to God & paid our sin debt (not reckoning our sins against us, ie: salvation). How many did Jesus die for: All (Praise God!). What should the person therefore do in return: be reconciled to God, no longer living for themselves but for Him who died for them (and us). We have been given the Word of Reconciliation (the Gospel). When we share UR we should not lose heart if the person does not accept the message, God is not calling them at that time, we need not wrestle with them ;). We can therefore confidently move on, leaving it to God's Holy Spirit to do the rest.
Just some thoughts. Hope this helps you in some way. Others here have given some great advise, thanks.
God bless and keep you. :)
Andrevan.
PKnowler:
--- Quote from: gmik on December 21, 2006, 10:20:12 PM ---I am going to be with relatives next week and I am dreading if this should come up. Like if they say, "How's church been?" Uh, I haven't been in 6 months. Then they say "why not" then I say...,...here is where I am stuck! Actually I really don't want to talk about it at all. They are way into Christendom and think we are deranged the way we have hopped around these last 30 years.
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I hope things went well with you and your family over the Holiday's. Did you get an opportunity to share? It is hard when people have preconceived ideas about us. But it is good that you have been actively seeking. I think people can become comfortable and stale in their thinking not to continue to grow and change.
--- Quote from: gmik on December 21, 2006, 10:20:12 PM ---The last time I tried to talk to a friend about this they were very polite but didn't want to know anymore. The time before that I shared my excitement w/ a best friend who did not believe one word even w/ all the scripture I presented. The very first time I talked about it after discovering Ray's site it was almost a knock down drag out!
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I think that is the time that we have to back off. I have experienced this with my Orthodox husband. He really doesn't want to hear what I have to say and I have been guilty of pressing trying to make Him Understand the Good News. It doesn't work! It only alienates people.
--- Quote from: gmik on December 21, 2006, 10:20:12 PM ---So....Ray's article is a Godsend. It has helped me not feel guilty to not say anything, but also to answer back in love about the hope that I have IF anyone asks me.
Love,
gena
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Very Good. It is not our work anyways it is the Spirit's work in us to lead and guide and teach us what to say! Amen
Thanks for sharing, Gena!
I appreciate it!
Blessings, Paula
PKnowler:
--- Quote from: Kat on December 21, 2006, 10:30:21 PM ---Hi Paula,
I'm glad to see you back :)
In regards to your question.
If it is God's will for us to share what we have learned, He will cause a person to ask.
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Thanks for the warm welcome. I need to spend more time with like minded believers instead of trying to
convert the orthodox believers on other forums. I've been a bad girl. Truly, I need to wait on the spirit's
leading like you said instead of arguing about doctrine. It does help sharpen the sword though to have
to give an answer to what you believe.
--- Quote from: Kat on December 21, 2006, 10:30:21 PM ---1Pe 3:14 But if you also suffer for righteousness' sake, you are blessed. And do not fear their fear, nor be troubled,
1Pe 3:15 but sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and be ready always to give an answer to everyone who asks you a reason of the hope in you, with meekness and fear;
1Pe 3:16 having a good conscience, that while they speak against you as evildoers they may be shamed, those falsely accusing your good behavior in Christ.
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Yes if we are persecuted let it be for righteousness sake not our own foolishness! And we need to be ready to give an answer for our hope when asked. Good Scriptures!
--- Quote from: Kat on December 21, 2006, 10:30:21 PM ---I have spoken of the Truth to family members and a few close friends a little, mainly to tell them I was not going to church anymore.
I don't live close to my extended family, and we've never discussed it since then, because they have never ask anything more.
If they did ask I would be glad to share with them or anyone, but I do not try to explain the Truth or even bring it up to anyone.
That is how I handle it.
It is a solitary journey of studying and learning.
I am so thankful for the forum, this is a wonderful place of fellowship.
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Thanks for sharing how you handle it with your family and friends. It is a solitary journey of learning and studying. I have finally come to a place to where my questions have mostly been answered so I am ready to share with others if that is what God would have me do. Other than my husband and older children, I've told my mother and she took it well but wasn't too inquisitive. Like you said it is probably better to wait until they ask before trying to share more.
I too am glad for a place of like-minded fellowship! Praise God!
--- Quote from: Kat on December 21, 2006, 10:30:21 PM ---This is a resent email to Ray.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2537.0.html ----------------------
Dear Beth:
Don't try to convert anyone. Be the best wife, mother, and friend that anyone could have, and THAT is the best thing that you and everyone else can do (unless you are a man, then, of course, the best husband, etc.,). You will never, ever, ever win someone over by a clever argument with the Scriptures. There are two reason why I do this and you shouldn't: [1] I am being a witness AGAINST all the heretics that attack me and the Truths of God, and [2] my answers to their foolish and unscriptural arguments are a great teaching tool for all those who read our site and who visit our Forum.
But in my private life, I do not try to convert, convince, change, etc., my neighbors and acquaintences. I will tell them the truth about God and the Scriptures, but I do not make a pest of myself. If and when people ask you, give them only as much as then need and are willing to accept. If they desire more, they will come back.
I would suggest you buy a Emphasized Bible by Joseph Rotherham. It is on a par with the Concordant Version, and it is Old and New in one volume, plus you can find it at any large Bible Book Store, and it will probably be considerably less expensive.
Don't study to be a scholar. Just learn what you need to know. Learn it until you know it and believe it, not so that you can win a debate in a room full of theologians. Things like "aion/aionios" will become clear after much study. "Free will" may also take awhile. Some fight it for years before they accept it. I personally immediately accepted it when I saw it and I was delighted to know it, as I was when I learned of the salvation of all. I find it hard to understand why so many hundreds email me and still think that they find Scriptures that contradict the free will/free choice heresy. Anyway, don't become discouraged.
You can certainly accomodate your husband's desire as much as is possible without partaking of his religion with him. I can certainly sit in a church and listen to a minister teach his heresy, without sinning. I would have no reason, however, to do this on a regular basis. Just give it time. "Don't be righteous over much" (Ecc. 7:16). God will direct your path. And who knows whether God will not begin to open your husband's mind in the future.
God be with you,
Ray
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That is a good word from Ray! It makes sense and gives a lot more freedom that we don't have to be on a mission to save the world and make known our beliefs. We just need to know what we know and be able to give an answer for it if someone ask. Amen!
Thanks for sharing Kat!
Blessings, Paula
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