To be absent from the body...

[sj]

While discussing with my friends and family "where we go after we die" a verse that is often brought up is the infamous misquotation "To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord."

The actual verse is found in 2 Corinthians 5:8 and reads as follows:

"...we are of good courage, I say, and prefer rather to be absent from the body and to be at home with the Lord."

In reading this verse I understand a couple of things...

1. Paul's preference is to be with the Lord rather than in his fleshly body.
2. That it is impossible to be with the Lord (who is spirit) when we are still in our fleshly form.
3. No where does it say that when we die we automatically are with the Lord.

It's interesting how we twist things to make them fit our theology isn't it?

Just curious if anyone else has been in discussion about this passage...I'm interested in your thoughts?
God's Peace.
Josh

[Deborah-Leigh]

Hi Josh

Just a thought....

Yes as you say : It's interesting how we twist things to make them fit our theology isn't it?

How is this for a twist?

We do not get to be with the Lord relatively speaking....HE gets to be with us as we are HIS temple He is not ours!

Worldly theology always gets the cart before the horse so to speak.....He he he hee!

Peace be to you

Arcturus

[sj]

Arcturus,

You state:

How is this for a twist?

We do not get to be with the Lord relatively speaking....HE gets to be with us as we are HIS temple He is not ours!

Worldly theology always gets the cart before the horse so to speak.....He he he hee!

Forgive me but I don't understand the difference? For instance... if you and I were in a room together... and I stated "I was with Arcturus" I don't believe that would be a statement of ownership, but rather a statement of proximity.

Even Paul states in 2 Cor. 5:8, that his preferences is TO BE WITH the Lord.

Or what about... 1Th 4:16-17 (Rotherman's)

"Because, the Lord himself, with a word of command, with a chief-messenger's voice, and with a trumpet of God, shall descend from heaven,—and, the dead in Christ, shall rise, first, After that, we, the living who are left, together with them, shall be caught away, in clouds, to meet the Lord in the air:—and, thus, evermore, with the Lord, shall we be!"

Notice Paul again makes the statement that "evermore, WITH THE LORD, we shall be.

Again, I appreicate the imput, but I do not see a difference.

God's Peace.
Josh

[Deborah-Leigh]

Hi Josh

It is simply a matter of protocal. Who is more important? Theology puts man first....Without Christ we are nothing yet the implications in Christiandom is that we...WE are the focus....and Christ is secondary.

Luke 13 : 26 Then you will begin to say, We...WE..ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our...OUR...streets.27. But He will say, I tell you, I do not know where, what household - certainly NOT MINE you come from, depart from Me all you wrongdoers!

It is just that I am sensitive to this error of priority that blasts out so called praise and worship songs and applauses group gatherings of carnality and self gratification and approval addictions, traditions and customs and other such things they do that voids the word of God.

Mark 7 : 13 Thus you are nulifying and making void and of no effect the authority of the Word of God through your tradition, which you in turn hand on. And many things of this kind you are doing.

Have you ever heard chalk scrape down a black board with a scrreeeethcccchinggg   scrattttchiiiiiing   sound?

Hope you can now see what I mean. I can not explain it better.

Peace to you

Arcturus

[Redbird]

John 15: 4
Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch can not bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine: no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

2 Cor 5: 15
And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

I myself feel quite confined in my body sometimes.  Once again, I think Paul is referring to carnel mind versus spiritual mind.

Lisa

[vic]

Hello All,

This is my first post.

I think it makes this verse much clearer if we read from 2 Cor 5:1   to verse 10. When I have discussd this with others, it seems to easier to consider in terms of preferring the Kingdom with a Spiritual body after  Christ returns.
v1   ... if our earthly house of this tabenacle is dissolved,  we have a building , (or body)  an house not made with hands (Spiritual), eternal in the heavens.

Vic.   

[buddyjc]

Hello All,

This is my first post.

I think it makes this verse much clearer if we read from 2 Cor 5:1   to verse 10. When I have discussd this with others, it seems to easier to consider in terms of preferring the Kingdom with a Spiritual body after  Christ returns.
v1   ... if our earthly house of this tabenacle is dissolved,  we have a building , (or body)  an house not made with hands (Spiritual), eternal in the heavens.

Vic.   

Very good Vic.  It does make things a little clearer.  I didn't realize that this verse fell within this chapter.  I have read this passage many times and never made the 'connection.'  Thanks

[sj]

Hello Everyone!

Arcturus,

We are in TOTAL agreement on who is more IMPORTANT. The purpose of my originial post was not to imply that God is secondary to His creation (infact, I posted a few weeks ago on my understanding of this issue in a thread 'God does not react, He acts!') I was simply stating what Paul himself stated. My apologies if it sounded like anything else but that.

Redbird & Vic,

I also had not thought of this particuliar verse in that light... your insight has helped my understanding a great deal. Thanks!

God's Peace
Josh

[Redbird]

Swivel
You are so very welcome.

Vic
Welcome to the forum. I am new too. This has been so great - it is amazing to see God at work in all of us!

Peace.
Lisa