Is Christ upon the throne, or the beast? Question regarding Conversion

[lilitalienboi16]

Ok, so i know that the disciples were not converted until after Christ died, ressurected and gave them the holy spirit, but my question is.

If i continualy serve the flesh, and the lust thereof, is Christ in me, is He sitting upon the throne of my heart, or am i yet not converted?

Because the disciples before they were converted believed in Christ, and i'm sure tried to follow Him, but could not, so am i converted yet? Or does the beast still reign?

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

[Kat]

Hi Alex,

Here is a few emails that may help you.

http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2888.0.html ---------

Dear Rob:
You are right, I cannot help you overcome your carnal sins. That is something that
we all have to do between ourselves and God. God is dealing with you and will
continue to deal with you. I cannot change God's timing for what He has in store
for your life.  Those of us who are maybe a little more mature, have all gone
through what you are going through.  That's why the Bible calls us BEASTS. We
often think and act and desire as do BEASTS.  You will not quit sinning until
God deems it time for you to quit, but in the mean time, you will come to hate
your sins, and still will not be able to overcome them. You will cry out to the only
One Who can help you. We all must make our "walk through the valley of the
shadow of death."  It is not a pleasant journey, but to come through it and have
a clean and clear conscious for the first time in your life, is itself quite rewarding.
God be with you,
Ray

http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2465.0.html --------

Dear Garrett:
Yours is a common frustration. Many write me with similar struggles
with the flesh after coming into a knowledge of the Truth. I did the
same. I left my First Love and went back into the world, all the while
knowing that I couldn't conquor my flesh. I was so happy for what I
'preceived to be "greasy grace."  Thank God for grace, because I knew
I wasn't going to be saved without it.
I still believe that that part of it is true (about saved by grace only), but
I also know that it is possible when God gets ready, to conquor your
major sins so that sin no longer "reigns over you."  You will not be totally
perfect and mature, but you will not be giving into every pull of the flesh,
for sexual gratification, lust for money, power, good looks, eternal youth,
perfect health, interesting job, travel and excitement, etc., etc., etc.  You
will learn to enjoy the simple pleasure of life like, breathing, sleeping,
walking, talking to your wife, eating a pizza, and going to bed early on a
Saturday night.
God will make you really WANT to stop sinning, long before you will
ACTUALLY stop sinning. It's part of the struggle; part of the good
fight of faith; part of overcoming the flesh.  Don't become discouraged, as
God WILL SEE YOUR THROUGH!

God be with you,
Ray 

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4069.0.html -------------

      Is there anyone capable of stopping to personally sin in their lifetime on earth?  Can you? I make the effort but at times fall short, most things about the Bible are confusing to me, especially if I try to ponder on them.  Does this mean that God is purposefully making me blind to awareness?  I am seeking the Lord,  I have diligently been seeking understanding since I wrote you a couple months ago.  I have read the majority of what you have written and it makes sense, but I am continually struggling and the more I learn, the more I realize I have to learn more!  More than what you write!  More!
     

        Dear Chad:

        With all due respect, it is not because of a lack of knowledge that your are not having victory over your sins. There comes a time to DO what you already know. However, I will come to your defense by stating that you will not become victorious over most of your sins unless and untill God determines that it is now time. I can only speak with authority when it comes to my own life. I had veasures of success in overcoming some things virtually the moment I learned the truth concerning them. For example, I quite using the Name of Jesus and God in profanity the week I came to realize how bad it was, and that was forty-five years ago, and I have never slipped up on it even once since then.   

        But the "lust of the flesh and the lust of the eys and the pride of life," are the biggies that God will allow to drag on in one's life until they really get sick of these sins. Some people never get sick of these sins--they LIKE them.  But the "Goodness of God" (Rom. 2:4) can make you repent and abhore these things.  We never conquer every sin as long as we are in the flesh, but we can come to the place that "sin no longer REIGNS over us."  I have no desire to sin. I do not think about sinning. There is nothing in the realm of sin that has any value to me.  I'll let Jesus be my Judge as to how far I have come in overcoming sin.  You have to cry out to God to rescue from sin. You cannot and you will not do it on your own power.

        God be with you
        Ray 
----------------------------------------------------------------------

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[lilitalienboi16]

ty kat, those emails helped but still the question remains.

If i believe in Christ but continualy sin and fail to follow him mean i'm converted and have the holy spirit IN ME and CHRIST ON THE THRONE OF MY HEART?

Does haveing Christ on the throne of ure heart only happen after u have overcome [after resurection?]

Do i have the holy spirit adn am converted but still the beast on the throne of my heart?

Do i just have the holy spirit but not converted and not Christ in me? [on the throne?]

Does haveing Christ on the throne, and haveing Him in you mean the samet hing?

Does haveing the holy spirit in you mean the same thing as haveing Christ in you meaning the same as haveing Him on the throne of your heart?

Is bieng converted all these things at once, or something totaly different?

I am confused when it comes to this, do u see my confusion?

I pray someone can help me better understand the Mind of Christ in such a matter.

Love and thanks,

Alex

[little rock]

here's a little insite Christ SITS  on the throne as a sign "it is finished,the job is done " has God finished with you yet in all areas or are you a work in progress?you have the spirit of Christ in you it is a down payment "be holy,for i am holy" is the call.may God guide you into the knowledge of his wonderful truths to His glory.fix your eyes on him.

[Kat]

Hi Alex,


I see what you are saying, these emails I think will explain what you are asking.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4194.0.html ----------

Acts 5:32 teaches us that God gives his Spirit only to those that do obey him:  Does one has to obey God before he even receive the Spirit?  It is a foolish question, but people do twist the Word in similar manner to prove foolishness.


Dear Calvin:

    Just as with Jesus' apostles, His spirit was WITH them long before it was IN THEM (John 14:17).
    As with John's disciples, he would not baptize them until they showed proof that they already had repented. That is why he would not baptize the Pharisees, as they had no proof that they repented of their sins.
    God be with you,
    Ray

http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,305.0.html ---------

    Dear Mark:
    I will make a few COMMENTS...........
 
    Hello Ray,

    I have recently been looking into the workings of the Spirit and have some questions.  Please guide me in the right direction.

    First concerning Jesus,  When did he receive the Spirit of the Lord?

    COMMENT:  Jesus Christ WAS CONCEIVED by the Holy Spirit!

      In Is 11:1-3 it talks about the Spirit resting upon Him as opposed to those in the Old Testament whom the Spirit came upon for a specific purpose and then departed.  It appears that John had the Spirit on him until Jesus' baptism, and then it seems like it left him and resided in Jesus permanently.

    COMMENT: Nonsense.

      Prior to his baptism, Jesus did no recorded supernatural works, did he not have the Spirit from birth?  What is your take on this?

    COMMENT: "Prior to baptism, Jesus had no recorded supernatural works..."  Oh really?  And you think that Jesus living a SINLESS LIFE as a teenager is less of a "supernatural work" than turning water into wine?

    Secondly, do those in "the church" have the Spirit?

    COMMENT:  NO, they have "a" spirit.

     If so, how did it come, why do they have it, and why is it so unproductive?

    COMMENT:  Oh, but their spirit of Satan is most productive. Along with doing "many wonderful works," they have succeeded in "deceiving the WHOLE WORLD."

      If not, how do those in "His church" get it, since it is most often that thay come out of "the church"?

    COMMENT: Coming out of the church is the only way that one will be given the Holy Spirit of God.

    Speaking for myself, it certainly seems that Jesus came quickly to me a couple of months ago with new ears.   After this,  virtually everything I was hearing in "the church" made no sense anymore.  Did I not have the Spirit prior to this?

    COMMENT:  I would not presume to say if or when you received God's Spirit, as I do not know you, what you believe, or how you live.

    Thanks for your help
    Mark

    COMMENT:  When sin no longer "has dominion over you," you will know that God's Holy Spirit is operating in you. Not that you will not sin, but sin will not lord it over you; you will no longer be a slave to sin; you will not be fighting sin ever moment of your day; you will be given peace in that area of your life.

    God be with you,
    Ray
--------------------------------------------------------------------

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[skydreamers]

Hi Alex,

Well it sure looks like God is working something out in you!!   Take heart, because having these questions is a good sign that you are going in the right direction, regardless of where you are at right now.

I heard Ray say in an audio once something like, if people are worried about what they are doing, for example, if they are worried about committing the unpardonable sin, then they certainly ARE NOT committing the unpardonable sin.  It is the awareness that you desire to seek after God and do His will that gives you a clue that He is indeed dealing with you. 

It is a joy to see such a young heart have such passion for God in desiring to know His truths.  When I was your age I still had 13 years to go before I even cared to know about Jesus!  And then I still went up and down and had another 8 years to go before I even began to understand who the REAL Jesus is!!!

Alex, I may not have all the answers to your questions, as I my self am still trying to figure some of this stuff out and I am over twice your age!! So I just want to encourage you that you are in an awesome place at such a young age.  Think of where you will be and what you will know when you are my age.!  I pray God will keep you on the path you are on.

Keep on keeping on brother, you are in good hands.

Peace,
Diana

[carol70]

I've been wondering about sin myself.

Ray said the following:

COMMENT: Coming out of the church is the only way that one will be given the Holy Spirit of God.

COMMENT:  When sin no longer "has dominion over you," you will know that God's Holy Spirit is operating in you. Not that you will not sin, but sin will not lord it over you; you will no longer be a slave to sin; you will not be fighting sin ever moment of your day; you will be given peace in that area of your life.

Is this the only way a person can stop sinning, not completely but in some areas?  What about those who haven't been called but manage to overcome certain sins - how exactly does that work?  Since nothing happens apart from God, I would assume His Holy Spirit is working in them too.  In other words, does God deal with everyone NOW in some way or just the ones who have been called out of the church?

[seminole]

Is it the Catholic church you speak of?

[Kat]

Hi Carol,

Also notice this that Ray said;  Just as with Jesus' apostles, His spirit was WITH them long before it was IN THEM (John 14:17).

That is what I believe happens that makes people cofussed.  Christ does work 'with' people, but it is only the few that He is indwelling.

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[lilitalienboi16]

Hi Alex,

Well it sure looks like God is working something out in you!!   Take heart, because having these questions is a good sign that you are going in the right direction, regardless of where you are at right now.

I heard Ray say in an audio once something like, if people are worried about what they are doing, for example, if they are worried about committing the unpardonable sin, then they certainly ARE NOT committing the unpardonable sin.  It is the awareness that you desire to seek after God and do His will that gives you a clue that He is indeed dealing with you. 

It is a joy to see such a young heart have such passion for God in desiring to know His truths.  When I was your age I still had 13 years to go before I even cared to know about Jesus!  And then I still went up and down and had another 8 years to go before I even began to understand who the REAL Jesus is!!!

Alex, I may not have all the answers to your questions, as I my self am still trying to figure some of this stuff out and I am over twice your age!! So I just want to encourage you that you are in an awesome place at such a young age.  Think of where you will be and what you will know when you are my age.!  I pray God will keep you on the path you are on.

Keep on keeping on brother, you are in good hands.

Peace,
Diana

Ty diana, Lord willing i shall be with you all -- allways. =]

[lilitalienboi16]

dang so many questions still, so as Christ's disciples knew, believed, and wanted to follow Him long before they were converted and had the Holy spirit in them, i too simply have Christ's spirit with me, and not in me yet?

Holy spirit is Christ's spirit, correct?

that would xplain why i sin alot, haha

damn beast, wheres a gun when you need it, i swear if i could find him i'd shoot him!


Kat can you answer me this please, it will greatly help me in my confusion. Is Having the holy spirit in you, the same as haveing Christ on the throne of your heart, or is that only gonna happen to anyone after the ressurection of the dead and God becomes all in all?

Love in Christ,

Alex

[Robin]

This is something that Kat posted for me last month that was helpful.

John 14:26  But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.

This is when your eyes opened, Christ is in you and He is teaching you to discern the truth.  You should be able to tell if you are seeing things new and different from before.  When yours eyes are opened, then you understand the truth, you can relate to those who speak this truth.  Then we are of like mind, when you believe the same truths that Christ is showing us.

1Co 2:10  But God has revealed them to us by His Spirit; for the Spirit searches all things, yea, the deep things of God.
v. 11  For who among men knows the things of a man except the spirit of man within him? So also no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God.
v. 12  But we have not received the spirit of the world, but the Spirit from God, so that we might know the things that are freely given to us by God.
v. 13  These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
v. 14  But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
v. 15  But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is judged by no one.
v. 16  For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ.

[Robin]

Alex,

I was just giving your posts some thought and wanted to share with you. There was a time when God showed me my beast on the throne. I don't even think we can see that without the Holy Spirit. I knew then that that beast was much bigger than I was and only God could save me. At that point I was totally dependent on God and knew there was nothing I could do to save myself. After that God started teaching me truth and that truth began setting me free. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. He is the answer to our beast problem. We enter in by faith and not by works.

Quotes from Ray

"For the weapons of our warfare are not CARNAL, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds" (II Cor. 10:4).

What then is it to be carnal or carnally minded? It's not good, I can tell you that. It's a monster—IT'S A BEAST:

"for to be carnally minded is DEATH..."

And just why is that?

"Because the carnal mind is enmity [DEEP-SEATED HATRED] against God: for it is NOT SUBJECT to the [spiritual] law of God, neither indeed CAN BE [Gk: 'is ABLE']. So then they that are in the flesh [carnal-minded] CANNOT please God" (Rom. 8:6-8).

Have YOU ever seen yourself as the man of sin?

Do you believe that YOU were once the son of perdition?

Have YOU ever been carnally-minded in your walk with God?

Have YOU ever left your first love?

Have YOU ever put your hand to the plough and looked back?

Has the spiritual house YOU built upon the sand fallen yet?

Have you fallen from grace since first believing?

No? You say, "NO—NEVER"! Then the chances are great that "ye are YET carnal."


But are we, who are members of the "house of God" considered "ungodly" people? Either we are "ungodly" sometime in our lives, or Jesus Christ didn't come to justify us or to die for our sins:

"But to him that works not, but believes on Him that justifies the UNGODLY, his faith is counted for righteousness" and "For when WE [believing Christians] were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for THE UNGODLY [that's us, that's everyone, that's ALL believers who will have their works tried in the fire, I Cor. 3:15]" (Rom. 4:5 and 5:6).

A word study will clearly show anyone that Jesus came to SAVE those who are and will be destroyed. And do I have a Scripture on that? I am glad that you asked. Here is a beautiful lesson that will show us just how important it sometimes is to know from what original word a word in our English translations came.

Here is the temporary fate of most humanity:

"Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leads to DESTRUCTION, and many there be which go in thereat" (Matt. 7:13).

Did Jesus come to SAVE all those who enter the broad gate to "destruction?" YES HE DID:

"For the Son of man is come to SAVE that which was LOST" (Matt. 18:11)!

There it is!

There is what? Where does that verse say that Jesus came to "SAVE that which was DESTROYED?" Why right in the verse, of course. You see, the New Testament was written in GREEK, and in Greek, here is what Matt. 18:11 says: "For the Son of man is come to SAVE that which was apollumi." And just what does apollumi mean in English? Strong's Greek Dictionary of the New Testament: "#622 {92x} apollumi to destroy, to perish, or lose" (page 37). Ninety-two times in the New Testament we read of "destroy, destruction, destroyed/perish, perishing, perished/lose and lost, and they are all translated from the same one word, apollumi! So whether one is destroyed, perished, or lost, it matters not to Jesus—HE SAVES THEM ALL!

Old Testament too:

"O Israel, you have DESTROYED yourself; but in Me is your help... I will ransom them from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death..." (Hosea 13:7 & 14)!

"The righteous PERISH, and no man lays it to heart..." (Isa. 57:1)

And concerning lost Israel God says,

"I will seek that which was LOST, and bring again that which was driven away..." (Ezek. 34:16).

Amazing grace! How sweet the sound

That saved a wretch like me!

I once was lost [apollumi—lost, perished, destroyed], but now am found;

Was blind, but now I see.

Oh the whole church world will sing about it, but they don't completely believe the words they sing. They will appropriate the word "sinner" and "lost," but few will confess to being "the man of sin" or "the son of perdition [destruction]."

So there are innumerable Scriptures that show that you and I and all humanity are or have been apollumi—lost/perished/destroyed. We all spiritually die once. The called and chosen are then judged in this lifetime, while the many called but not chosen (and all unbelievers) will be judged in the second resurrection white throne judgment.

We all fit this description of "the man of sin, the son of perdition" of which Paul speaks. And when Paul tells us where this man of sin and son of perdition" resides, he removes all doubt of whom he is speaking.


BEFORE THE DAY OF THE LORD CAN COME TO YOU

Here then is what must be accomplished in your life before you die:

"Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfill all the good pleasure of His goodness, and the work of faith with power: THAT the Name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be GLORIFIED IN YOU [IN YOU], and YE IN HIM, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ" (I Thes. 1:11-12)!!

How then does our Apostle Paul tell us this MUST be accomplished? What must happen? What must we do? Or rather what must Jesus do IN US? Here is the Scriptural answer:

"Now we beseech YOU, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto Him.

That ye be not soon shaken in mind or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that THE DAY OF CHRIST [The Day of the Lord] is at hand [FOR YOU...].

Let no man deceive YOU by any means: for that day shall not come [TO YOU...] except there come a FALLING AWAY FIRST [BY YOU...], and the man of sin be revealed the son of perdition [IN YOU...TO YOU...]; Who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped [IN YOU...]; so that he as God sits in the temple of God ['which temple YE ARE' II Cor. 6:16] showing himself that HE IS [YOU ARE / I AM] a god

Remember ye not, that when I was yet with YOU, I told YOU these things?

And now ye know what withholds [is restraining, is detaining—'the falling away FIRST'] that he ['the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition'—YOU...] might be revealed in his time [in YOU and TO YOU—individually, not collectively] in his time ['his {particular} time']—FOR YOU and FOR ME and for ALL BELIEVERS IN ALL GENERATIONS UNTIL JESUS COMES TO US ALL, COLLECTIVELY, AS THE MANIFEST SONS OF GOD]."

Long before Jesus can have a COMPANY of manifest SONS and DAUGHTERS of God, there has to be individual begettals by the Holy Spirit of God in chosen individuals in every generation leading up to the coming of the Lord at the end of this age.

"For the mystery [secret, hidden truth] of iniquity [lawlessness] does already work ['is inwardly working' The Emphasized New Testament: A New Translation (J. B. Rotherham)]: only he who now lets will let ['only he who restrains will do so'], until he be taken out of the way.

And then shall that Wicked [Lawless One] be revealed IN [IN YOU] and TO YOU, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit [breath] of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming;

Even him [not original], whose coming [the man of sin called son of perdition IN YOU] is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders" (II Thes. 2:1-9).


THANK GOD, that I (L. Ray Smith) had fallen away, left my first love, looked back, forsook the Lord, and watched my house upon the sand come crashing down! Only then was I able to stand upon the sand of the sea, and see the beast within, the man of sin, the son of perdition, and Satan the devil who DECEIVED ME!

But NOW, "I am crucified WITH Christ: nevertheless I live: yet not I, but Christ lives IN ME: and the life which I now life in the flesh I live by the faith OF the Son of God, who loved ME [and YOU], and gave Himself for ME [and YOU]" (Gal. 2:20).

[lilitalienboi16]

TY MG, that helped quiet a bit

now i see that the Holy spirit is in me, but i know not if that means i'm converted, because i do not know what it means to be converted and i know not if Christ sits upon the throne because i do still sin, serve the lust of the flesh greatly, though i do not want to, and im overcome by the beast constantly, i feel i have no confidence to say Christ is upon this throne [in me], because if He was, would i not then be sinless? So when does Christ sit upon the throne of our hearts? The throne which the beast sits on?

[skydreamers]

Is Having the holy spirit in you, the same as haveing Christ on the throne of your heart, or is that only gonna happen to anyone after the ressurection of the dead and God becomes all in all?

Here's some things I looked in thinking about your question:

1 Kings 2:3-4
3  and keep the charge of the LORD your God, walking in his ways and keeping his statutes, his commandments, his rules, and his testimonies, as it is written in the Law of Moses, that you may prosper in all that you do and wherever you turn,
4  that the LORD may establish his word that he spoke concerning me, saying, 'If your sons pay close attention to their way, to walk before me in faithfulness with all their heart and with all their soul, you shall not lack a man on the throne of Israel.'


(Israel being God's people)

1 Kings 3:6-9
6  And Solomon said, "You have shown great and steadfast love to your servant David my father, because he walked before you in faithfulness, in righteousness, and in uprightness of heart toward you. And you have kept for him this great and steadfast love and have given him a son to sit on his throne this day.
7  And now, O LORD my God, you have made your servant king in place of David my father, although I am but a little child. I do not know how to go out or come in.
8  And your servant is in the midst of your people whom you have chosen, a great people, too many to be numbered or counted for multitude.
9  Give your servant therefore an understanding mind to govern your people, that I may discern between good and evil, for who is able to govern this your great people?"

2 Kings 10:30
30 Because you have done well in carrying out what is right in my eyes, and have done to the house of Ahab according to all that was in my heart, your sons of the fourth generation shall sit on the throne of Israel.

Jeremiah 3:15-18
15  "'And I will give you shepherds after my own heart, who will feed you with knowledge and understanding.
16  And when you have multiplied and increased in the land, in those days, declares the LORD, they shall no more say, "The ark of the covenant of the LORD." It shall not come to mind or be remembered or missed; it shall not be made again.
17  At that time Jerusalem shall be called the throne of the LORD, and all nations shall gather to it, to the presence of the LORD in Jerusalem, and they shall no more stubbornly follow their own evil heart.

Alex, I wonder as well about what you are asking about the indwelling spirit being the same as Jesus on the throne.  But I'm thinking they are not the same.  These scriptures seem to say to me that there will come a time when the chosen will sit on the throne with Jesus, thus they will be Kings with Him.  For this to happen a person must be:


* walking in his ways and keeping his statutes, his commandments, his rules, and his testimonies

* paying close attention to their way, walking before the Lord in faithfulness with all his  heart and with all his soul

* desiring an understanding mind to govern His people, that he may discern between good and evil

* doing well in carrying out what is right in the eyes of God

* a shepherd after God's own heart who will feed His people with knowledge and understanding

*no more stubbornly following their own evil heart

(I'm sure there is more to it than even that, but this is what I found in these scriptures)

Then I looked at what it means to have the spirit of God dwelling in you:

Romans 8:9-13
9  You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him.
10  But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11  If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.
12  So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.
13  For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.




1 John 4:11-17
11  Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another.
12  No one has ever seen God; if we love one another, God abides in us and his love is perfected in us.
13  By this we know that we abide in him and he in us, because he has given us of his Spirit.
14  And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
15  Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God.
16  So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.
17  By this is love perfected with us, so that we may have confidence for the day of judgment, because as he is so also are we in this world.




So as I look at these scriptures together, I tend to think that God lives within his chosen, giving them the understanding of God's true Love, that Jesus is the Savior of THE WORLD, and this leads to loving our brothers and the world in a different way than we ever have before.  By this love, we are perfected and this gives us confidence for the day of judgment. 

But I'm thinking that Jesus takes his seat on the throne of our hearts completely when we are raised, in the meantime He is ministering to us from the inside.

Hebrews 8:1-2
1  Now the point in what we are saying is this: we have such a high priest, one who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven,
2  a minister in the holy places, in the true tent that the Lord set up, not man.

Matthew 19:27-28
27  Then Peter said in reply, "See, we have left everything and followed you. What then will we have?"
28  Jesus said to them, "Truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the Son of Man will sit on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

So it is when Jesus sits on the throne, that the Elect will also sit on thrones with Him.

That is when the Elect will fulfill the requirements I listed above.

In the meantime, the spirit of God dwells in the Elect, fashioning them to perfection from the inside out.

At least, that's how I see it so far.  I may be missing something, so I hope that others may be able to add their insights.

May God give us eyes to see His truth,

Peace,
Diana 

[lilitalienboi16]

wow diana that was beautiful, i see it now as you do.

Great post and ty!

Anyone else have anything to add, any wisdom or understanding to share?

Love in Christ,

Alex

[rvhill]

2Th 2:3 let no man beguile you in any wise: for it will not be, except the falling away come first, and the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition,
2Th 2:4 he that opposeth and exalteth himself against all that is called God or that is worshipped; so that he sitteth in the temple of God, setting himself forth as God.

1Co 3:16 Know ye not that ye are a temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?