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Author Topic: Trinity  (Read 5784 times)

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« on: July 19, 2007, 07:00:47 PM »

Dear Shane:  Obviously I HAVE read II Cor. 3:17. But obviously, [1]  you are not sticking to the words that I used. I did not say "Lord" but "God." So don't change my words, and [2] you don't even understand what the doctrine of the trinity is.  Here is a definition of the trinity by a true Trinitarian:
What is the Trinity?
     "The word "trinity" is a term used to denote the Christian doctrine that God exists as a unity of three distinct persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.  Each of the persons is distinct from the other, yet identical in essence.  In other words, each is fully divine in nature, but each is not the totality of the Trinity.  Each has a will, loves, and says "I", and "You" when speaking.  The Father is not the same person as the Son who is not the same person as the Holy Spirit who is not the same person as the Father.  Each is divine, yet there are not three gods, but one God.  There are three individual subsistences, or persons.  The word "subsistence" means something that has a real existence. The word "person" denotes individuality and self awareness."
The trinity teaching is not that the Holy Spirit is God, but that the Holy Spirit IS A PERSON!! And this is decidedly NOT SCRIPTURAL at all.

    Hello ray,
     Let me tell you i thank God for you brother. You speak what is the truth MOST of the time.  However you are mistaken on the trinity. I once read a response of yours to a reader about how there is no scripture in the bible that calls The Holy Spirit God. Obviously you have never read 2 cor 3:17
    COMMENT:  II Cor. 3:17 does NOT SAY that "The Holy Spirit is God," does it?
     which clearly states  "NOW the LORD IS THE SPIRIT".  The emphasiis is on the word "is". If you read those words backwards you would have "Now the SPIRIT IS THE LORD!.   Therefore the question becomes who is "THE LORD"?
    ALL one has to do is read the "ten" commandments to find the answer
    COMMENT:  Oh really?  In II Cor. 3:17, the word for "Lord" is "kurios" and it is used of Jesus Christ nearly 700 times in the New Testament.  "The Lord" of II Cor. 3:17 is clearly Jesus Christ, not God the Father.
    I AM "THE LORD" THY GOD THOU SHALL Have no other gods before me.  Clearly THE lord of 2 corinthians is the same LORD throughout the entire old testament, who f course  is the FATHER.
    COMMENT:  The Lord of the Old Testament is "Jehovah" which is a Proper NAME, not a title as is "Lord" in the New Testament. Even so, Jehovah was NOT Jesus' Father, but Jesus Himself. Moses heard ahnd saw Jehovah, whereas NO MAN HAS EVER seen or heard the Father (John 5:37). But of course, this would require one to believe the Scriptures, and not too many people are willing to do that.
      THerefore SInce the "SPIRIT" (holy spirit) is THE LORD(the father), the father must be the spirit.
    COMMENT:  The "Spirit" is the possession of God the Father--it is "The Spirit OF God."  However, God has given His Son Jesus Christ this SAME spirit. God has shared ALL with His Son: "ALL power in heaven and earth is given Me" (Matt. 28:18).  Jesus takes of the Spirit His Father has given Him and gives it to US (John 16:15).  The "Comforter" (the "parakletos) IS JESUS.  "And if any man sin, we have an Advocate [Gk: 'parakletos] with the Father, JESUS CHRIST the righteous" (I John 2:1). Jesus Christ IS, the Lord of the Old Testament; the Lord of the New Testament, the Comforter (Parakletos), which is the promised Holy Spirit, which comes to us through JESUS CHRIST, and so "The Lord is that SPIRIT."
    God be with you,

    any replies ray?
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