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Mark J.:
Hi all

I need a little help with a question I have after reading some of Ray's papers.

First up, I joined this forum because I do agree with what Ray has imparted to us through  the divining God's word through His spirit. But i'm stuck on something.

I wholeheartedly agree that God will not be casting the majority of the human race into eternal torment, and that He will be saving everyone through His son Jesus Christ.

My question though is this:

What DOES occur with those who have neither heard or, have heard but reject the gospel of Jesus Christ? Probably more the latter. Those who have heard but rejected it. How will they be brought to acceptance of the gospel, particularly after death?

What will be happening to the serial killers, child molesters and mass rapists after they die in their sin having rejected the gospel of Christ?

zander:
Hey mark.

Ray answers a lot of this in his papers.

But here a few scriptures.

Revelation 17:14 tells us exactly who the elect are:

These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

This means that not only do you have to be called, you must be chosen and even then its not complete, you must be faithful to Christ's laws.  So understanding and rejecting is no use.  You are therefore not chosen to be with Christ in the next age if you do this.

Regarding "Those that have never heard" you should read Rays paper on it and then reference all his scriptures with your bibles/scriptures to make sure its correct.

Mark J.:
Thanks Zander

But that wasn't what I was asking.

What I was asking was, if in the end the whole world is to be saved, then in a sense aren't all these sinners, and yes I know i'm one of them, kind of getting off scot free?

And before you go there, yes, I know as believers that we are under the grace of God purchased by Christs blood for all our sins.

Here's an example to try and make it clear what it is I'm actually asking:

A child molester/ axe murderer/ mass rapist , ( insert heinous crime), is later in life offered a chance to repent of his sin and accept Christ. He rejects this offer. He dies.

Then what happens to him?

He's rejected Christ, so he's without representation at judgement before the throne of God to give account for his actions. He's NOT under grace because he rejected Christ.

What is God going to do with the likes of these people?

That's what I'm asking.

I'm convinced that there is no eternal torment in Hell, but what then is  the cost of rejecting Christs salvation?

I also know that the wages of sin is death. I'm talking about the judgement. Without some sort of punishment judgement becomes kind of redundant.

Do you see what I'm getting at?

I'm just trying to understand and would appreciate some help.

eutychus:
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Mark J.:
OK. So now we're saying there IS INDEED burning in Hell and therefore it logically follows that not everyone will be saved.

I've misunderstood what Ray was saying then. Because he was really pushing the line that Christ was the saviour of the whole world, but if there are people burning in Hell, I guess that doesn't happen. Where is the salvation for them?

Can someone please give me something definitive on this that I can wrap my head around?

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