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Author Topic: Sad there's no hell  (Read 3541 times)

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stephen

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Sad there's no hell
« on: April 20, 2008, 04:11:02 PM »

Hi, I've been studying Ray's teachings for about 6 months. One thing still amazes me. To my mind the revelation that there is no everlasting hell of torture for unbelievers is like music to the ears. When I first came to this knowledge I was filled with joy to realise that
friends and family who I previously thought are going to suffer eternally in hell would ultimately be saved. Yet you share this with most Christians and they are offended, as if to demand that unbelievers must be punished. How can they not burn forever, they deserve it, afterall they're not saved and not on our level.

Selfish is to mild a word to describe them. Are they really saved?

Steve
South Africa
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eggi

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2008, 04:31:02 PM »

Hello Steve,

Many are filled with hate. Others haven't really given much thought as to what they actually believe. Yet others are afraid and full of anxiety, and they dare not open their mind to a new thought.

We are blessed if we hear the gospel and believe it. It is quite usual to see people react in the way you describe. Like Ray said once: "Hell hath no fury like a Christian who has just been told the truth".

We must pray for those who still do not know God, and at all times appreciate the blessings we have been given.

God be with you,
Eirik
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Here’s how to tell if you have faith; how do you live… what do you do… what do you accomplish in life… what are your goals… What is there about you that proves that you have this faith and belief inside of you? What?

winner08

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2008, 05:00:34 PM »

Hay Steve: I am about a month old in the teaching of Ray. I can say with no uncertainty that I know in my heart there is no such place as a hell. Where A god who loves all humans on this earth who evered lived and will ever live send them to a place such as the fable hell. If one is to beleive this, then you are say that Satan is more powerful than God Himself. Who created ALL thing that you see with your own eyes. Mountains, oceans wild life and flowers how beautiful are flowers? Can (Satan) create anything? NO he can not. So who's more powerful? Who 's Will, will be done. I'm not going to change your mind or heart, but if you believe scripture read Ray's serious on the lake of fire. Ray shows you chapter and virus where God will save all mankind. Read it yourself, you'll see.

                                     PS He also created everthing you don't see.

                                          Thanks Darren
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Samson

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2008, 05:19:00 PM »

Hello Steve,

Many are filled with hate. Others haven't really given much thought as to what they actually believe. Yet others are afraid and full of anxiety, and they dare not open their mind to a new thought.

We are blessed if we hear the gospel and believe it. It is quite usual to see people react in the way you describe. Like Ray said once: "Hell hath no fury like a Christian who has just been told the truth".

We must pray for those who still do not know God, and at all times appreciate the blessings we have been given.

God be with you,
Eirik

   Good Post Eirik,

                         I concur, most people were taught the opposite regarding our Eternal prospects, rather than being Sad their is no Hell as the title of this Thread, they appear Mad(angry) about this, as frustrating as this can get for us, it's part of God's Plan for most of Mankind to believe the lie. Of course, all of us already know this and I certainly due appreciate the blessings provided by God through Ray and our fellowship experienced at this Site. It's had a calming affect on my disposition and my wife will tell you, I'm not normally a calm type person, more Type A.

                                  Thankyou Eirik & Steve for your Posts, Samson.
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eggi

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2008, 06:37:16 PM »

Samson, as a matter of fact I just heard someone say today, that believing in Hell gives his life a purpose. A purpose to serve God. This thought is now so far out to me, that I can't even relate to that. Although he agreed that there is no fire in Hell, he believes that "hell" means "eternal separation" from God. I can't wait to see how their god will solve that relocation problem, since God is omnipresent...

No answer...

I mean, I'm just amazed at how strong the delusion is... but that too will be done away with in due time:

And he will swallow up on this mountain the covering that is cast over all peoples, the veil that is spread over all nations. (Isa 25:7 ESV)

God bless you,
Eirik
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Here’s how to tell if you have faith; how do you live… what do you do… what do you accomplish in life… what are your goals… What is there about you that proves that you have this faith and belief inside of you? What?

Kat

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2008, 08:43:15 PM »


The people in the church are indoctrinated with the idea of hell.

Indoctrination is the process of inculcating (teach by repeated instruction) ideas, attitudes, cognitive (development of concepts) strategies or a professional methodology (a body of methods and rules followed in a discipline).  It is often distinguished from education by the fact that the indoctrinated person is expected not to question or critically examine the doctrine they have learned.  (From Wikipedia)

Think how much a person raised in church has been instructed in the doctrines of the church, these children except it as truth, because that's all they know.  Even entering a church as an adult, when you have heard something over and over (the process of inculcating), and you want to belong, so you will begin to except even something as irrational as hell. 

We all know how hard it is to 'unlearn' all these untruths we have been deceived with.  But we don't hate these people, some of them are our loved ones and we were in their mist at one time.

deceive - 1 : to cause to believe an untruth 2 : to use or practice deceit; syn beguile, betray, delude, mislead.

Titus 3:3  For we ourselves were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another.

These people that cling to this deranged idea of hell, will only give up this belief in the Lake of fire. 

Luke 13:27  and he shall say, I say to you, I have not known you whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of the unrighteousness.
v. 28  `There shall be there the weeping and the gnashing of the teeth...

mercy, peace and love
Kat

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Little Joe

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2008, 08:49:32 PM »

The first time I read Ray's teaching on universal reconciliation I was excited, thrilled, overjoyed, exuberant, relieved, unburdened, emancipated, free, lifted up, well you get my drift!  ;D
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Craig

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2008, 08:51:08 PM »

That was good for me too Joe, (milk) but the thing that brought everything into focus and me off my perch was the Beast within.

Craig
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Little Joe

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2008, 09:08:01 PM »

That was good for me too Joe, (milk) but the thing that brought everything into focus and me off my perch was the Beast within.

Craig

Man, I hear ya Craig!  That has been brought to home more to me recently than ever before!  :o

Peace,\

Joe
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gmik

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2008, 10:23:31 PM »

How HAPPY people should be to hear that there is no unending torture for anyone.


I cannot believe how people defend it!!  Gosh, I was so glad to hear about it and was so relieved.  Yet some of my loved ones want to cling to it!!

Without any scripture or even any belief of any kind....wouldn't it make sense to not believe in a hell??? You know from a logic point of view?
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joyful1

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2008, 06:55:00 AM »

I know what you mean, Gena-- the entire FOUNDATION of the house that they've built for themselves is being shaken and if they begin to think about the lies of hell, it feels as though the FOUNDATION is going to be washed away! (which of course it WILL be!) The beast wants "a certain dwelling place" ....demands that they (us) never give in to accepting the house to be destroyed! you know?

We've been "given" the ears to hear.....the test now is to realise that it WAS GIVEN to us....we cannot act like it was NOT a gift--right?

(just thinking out loud here, Gena...I know that you are grateful for His gifts, that is very apparent in you! I hope that I will always be grateful for His gifts also! )

John 3:27
John answered and said, A man can receive nothing, except it be given him from heaven.

1 Corinthians 4:7
For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?

Joyce :)
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kweli

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2008, 09:20:00 AM »

If one is to beleive this, then you are say that Satan is more powerful than God Himself

I once asked someone what they think worship is. They said it is giving glory to God. Then I asked, when we condemn most of the population to a hellhole for all eternity, who are we giving glory to?(actually, I wanted to ask when last they actually worshipped/gave glory to God  ;D) I couldnt believe their answer could possibly be God. Then I asked, if god doesnt win in the end, why do we bother worshipping him. What if he cant take control of his own kingdom and he gets overthrown somehow. I mean after all he didnt win the first time...

Apparently Im a devil worshipper. Former fellow church folks are now careful when around me. I might just start praying in some demonic language (hmm, where have I seen that before?) and get them possessed or something  :D :D :D

All Glory to Him
May He have mercy on all of us
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Martinz

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2008, 10:05:21 AM »

Other than a brief peek on L Ray's rave on hell, I haven't yet looked at it proper, so I have to say, at this point: "I don't know".

But, what I really want to say is, and it follows on from what the previous posts have been saying:
Belief in eternal hell is part of the Church's agenda as a tactic to 'scaremonger' people into having faith in God - but the hidden agenda is that people's belief in hell is also 'grooming' them into a dependency upon the church; kind of saying: "Believe what we tell you - or else!!!" This 'church agenda' seems to indicate the 'fruit' that the church is more concerned more about its power over the people than it is in bringing God's truth to the people. We all need to try and understand the tactics that the church uses to deceive people in this way 'cause there is so much of it around. Then we can understand why conventional Christian's get sooo confronted by L Ray's teachings as it challenges their fixed preconceived dogma's. Maybe established churches need to realize that they don't have an answer for everything and that the kingdom and ways of God are mysterious. Of course the churches don't want to admit this because it takes power away from them - because, guess where the real power comes from?

Ultimately, we don't have any confirmation of the 'afterlife' until we cross the 'other side', so perhaps people need to focus more on 'life before death' rather than 'life after death'. This seems to be the attitude of the Quakers, who don't want to impose any beliefs on their congregation concerning either the afterlife or endtime prophesies. I tend to agree with this.
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Phil3:10

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2008, 03:31:23 PM »

Martinz,
I do so very much agree with your assessment of why traditional, institutionalized, organized, denominational churches hold on to and cherish the concept of hell. It is power and control that they truly seek. It is their way or the highway and there is a virtual cafeteria of beliefs to fit each person. If anyone is unhappy they can break off and create their own system. Most of these Babylonian churches will never realize that it is only CHRIST and nothing else.
Phil 3:10
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Vangie

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2008, 04:03:13 PM »

Hi Martinz,
I understand you're not too involved in Ray's writings as of yet, but you would probably enjoy Ray's "An Encouraging Word About Death" in the middle of the home page.  Based on your post that mentions "afterlife" and the "other side", I bet you'd really enjoy the article in relation to your studies.  It puts a whole different spin on how you absorb and appreciate scripture and the good news of the gospel!  Personally, I got a lot out of that one to dispel the confusion and contradictions that churchianity teaches.  Steve and all, hope you don't mind that I suggested the article; this thread really seems appropriate for the subject! :)  I sent the link to some of my own family members, but it wasn't His will (yet?!) to open their minds and eyes to absorb the concept.  They continue to believe that dead grandparents are either looking down on us or frying eternally, depending on which ones we're talking about.  Kat's post about indoctrination of the church's beliefs describes the causality of this viewpoint so well!     

In His Love,
Vangie
« Last Edit: April 22, 2008, 04:08:34 PM by Vangie »
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KristaD

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2008, 09:28:43 PM »

Yeah, Stephen, I see the same thing :'(. Even people who aren't so "christian" can't believe the truth. Yes, they are selfish beyond words, we all are without God changing that in us. It's exactly like the parable with the workers, the ones who worked all day and the ones who worked for just an hour. The ones who'd worked all day were mad when the newer workers got the same pay. Just the same, people who've spent their lives in church "serving" God are upset when they hear that people who didn't go to church are saved too ::). To answer your question though, YES they ARE saved. We all are, it's just that God didn't choose to call out and open the eyes of everybody just yet. That's what's so truly humbling about it. Being religious and going to church doesn't count for anything, He either opens your eyes or he doesn't. They may still be blind but rest assured we only see because He made us and if He took it away we'd be right where they are. Saved, yes, but not chosen.
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Martinz

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Re: Sad there's no hell
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2008, 01:55:50 PM »

Phil3:10 - Yes...and rather than conform to the fixed beliefs of the church, through the Holy Spirit, conform to each to our beautiful God created uniquenesses! You know: "Be true to ourselves"....

Vangie - I read 'An encouraging word about death': ;)

The Art of Dying: Live totally with the Love of God - die totally with the Love of God - let that 'tractor-beam' you up to heaven!!! Like 'Consciousness', The Love of God exists independently regardless of whether we on this side or the other side; it is the only constant between this side and the other side. Knowing that:Live consciously with the Love of God. :)
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