> General Discussions
Why "Soul" and "Spirit"?
Daniel:
Chrissie brought up an excellent point. Unless we drink His blood (Spiritual) we have no "life" in us who are living souls (as Adam was) as the Lord said right?
Daniel
chrissiela:
--- Quote from: lightseeker ---Please give honest and sincere dialogue.
--- End quote ---
Any reason to believe that the dialogue here is not honest and/or sincere?? :shock:
Maybe I missed it, but did someone say that there is not a body, a spirit and a soul?
All ‘three’ are mentioned in the scriptures.
The body is not the spirit, neither is it the soul…. and vise versa (as applicable to each).
But ONE (the soul) is a 'combination' of the other two.... all resulting in ONE
‘whole’ (person).
The same can be said for the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit/Ghost, couldn’t it?
All ‘three’ are mentioned in the scriptures.
Yet, the Holy Spirit does not exist independent of the Father and the Son but is, in essence, a 'combination' of the Father and the Son.... who are ONE 'whole' (God).
Maybe I am not understanding your question or the reason for the references that you gave??
Chrissie
hillsbororiver:
Lightseeker, I had asked you before whether you have read any material on this Bible Truths, you told me you had. So I can only guess you missed this one; http://bible-truths.com/lake16-C.html
It is right on top of Ray's page, here is a portion of it;
DR. STRONG’S USE OF CONTRADICTIONS AND SQUARE CIRCLES
I personally use Dr. Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible. It is a most helpful book. However, when it comes to the major "damnable heresies" of Christendom, Dr. Strong plays the same game of contradictions and square circles, as do the pastors and theologians.
Next, let’s study Strong’s definition of soul in the Hebrew and soul in the Greek:
In the Hebrew Scriptures, soul is translated from, H5315 nephesh = neh'-fesh
From H5314; properly a breathing creature, that is, animal or (abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental): - any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, X dead (-ly), desire, X [dis-] contented, X fish, ghost, + greedy, he, heart (-y), (hath, X jeopardy of) life (X in jeopardy), lust, man, me, mind, mortality, one, own, person, pleasure, (her-, him-, my-, thy-) self, them (your) -selves, + slay, soul, + tablet, they, thing, (X she) will, X would have it.
Say, did you catch that one word Dr. Strong used to define the soul—nephesh?
He used as a definition of "soul," the word "MORTALITY." How pray tell, can pastors, teachers, and theologians tell us that man’s soul is IMMORTAL, when the very definition of "soul—nephesh" is "MORTAL." Yes, of course, Godly men inspired by God’s Holy Spirit have always known that man is "mortal"—"Shall MORTAL man be more just than God…" (Job 4:17).
And so, what kind of a "living soul" did Adam become? Why a "living [mortal] soul," of course. Maybe that’s why Jesus also stated that "souls" can be "destroyed." We cannot separate the man from his soul in two different parts, as though the soul were something that existed independently of the body. For this reason, when the Bible speaks of "people" dying or being destroyed, it sometimes refers to them as "souls," for the soul is the person. Adam himself was the "living soul." (See: Joshua 10:28,35,37,39).
In the Greek Scriptures, soul is translated from, G5590 psuche¯ = psoo-khay'
"From G5594; breath, that is, (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from G4151, which is the rational and immortal soul; and on the other from G2222, which is mere vitality, even of plants: these terms thus exactly correspond respectively to the Hebrew [H5315], [H7307] and [H2416]: - heart (+ -ily), life, mind, soul, + us, + you."0
Next notice this statement in Strong’s definition of psuche above: "G4151, which is the rational and IMMORTAL SOUL." Oh really? Just like that? Noticed how casually Dr. Strong just dropped that little gem into his definition of soul. First he confirms the fact that the soul of man is MORTAL, but then quickly asserts that there is, however, another, different Greek word, which really does mean immortal soul, and it is the Greek word # 4151—pnuma.
Even though Dr. Strong knew the Hebrew word nephesh meant "mortal," and not "immortal" he nonetheless must be quick to inform us of his own personal heresy, and tell us that although the nephesh/soul of man is mortal, nevertheless man also possesses an "immortal" soul. And in so doing, we must conclude that that (‘mortal’ Job 4:17) man possesses two souls: one mortal and one immortal. Do Christians ever think about all these unscriptural heresies? Of course not. As we learned in the Army—"Ours is not to reason why; ours is but to do or die."
So the Greek word #4151 = pnuma, is the "immortal soul?" I would have never guessed: I always thought pnuma meant "spirit." You all know, I hope, that in the King James Version, the words "spirit" and "ghost" are translated from the exact same Greek word "pnuma," don’t you? Well, now you do.
Now, get this: pnuma is used in the Greek Scriptures approximately 360 times. And Dr. Strong tells us that this word pnuma IS the word for "immortal soul." So just how many times do you think this word is translated "immortal soul" out of the 360 verses which contain the Greek word pnuma?" Oh, go ahead—guess? Three hundred? Two hundred? Fifty? Ten? Three? One? Would you believe not even once? What about the "soul" by itself. How many times is pneuma translated "soul?" Three hundred? Two hundred? Fifty? Ten? Three? One? Would you believe none?
That’s right, none. Not once is this word pnuma, which Dr. Strong tells us is the proper word for "immortal soul," actually translated "immortal soul." It is always translated "spirit" [sometimes, ‘ghost’], but never "immortal soul." Nor is it even translated "soul" even without the prefix, "immortal."
No one here believes Strong (or even any translation is perfect) that is why we are admonished to compare spiritual to spiritual and to gather at least 2 witnesses.
Joe
hillsbororiver:
Lightseeker,
Here is more reading for you given in the spirit of honest and sincere dialogue.
Spiritual Meaning Of Key Words In Scripture;
Soul
The attachment God has with each individual person is his creation. The soul is not alive without a body, be it a physical body at creation and conception: "He formed man of the dust of the ground and He breathed into him the breath of life and he became a living soul" (Gen. 2:7), or a spiritual body at the resurrection: It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body (I Cor. 15:44). A dead body is not a conscious body (Ecc. 3:18-20) but is "asleep in Christ" or not in Christ but asleep (I Cor. 15:18). But God does not forget "the work of His hands" (Job 14:15) and refers to the soul as His 'darling' in Psa. 22:20 and 35:17. The soul is Gods knowledge of who we are dead or alive.
Psa 104:29 Thou hidest thy face they are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.
Ecc 3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.
http://www.*not-allowed*.com/spiritdie.php
http://www.*not-allowed*.com/soultruth.php
Joe
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: Lightseeker ---Good imput guys. Verses I've never been taught or thought of before concerning this subject.
--- End quote ---
Then you write? I now have more than the first unanswered verse begging for explanation. So once again I'll ask for some one to give me a good explanation for man being biparte instead of triparte. And another misinterpretation IMO from Genesis and Strong's isn't what I'm looking for. I've known about both of them for a long long time. Please give honest and sincere dialogue.
Lightseeker, both of these quotes are yours, in the same thread, what is up Brother?
Joe
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