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End Times

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David:
I agree with what the other posters have said, 1 its spiritual, 2 only God knows when.
With regard to any physical manifestation of the end times, its always intrigued me how the Church always teaches their end time nonsense in humanistic terms. If you listen to typical end time prophesy type teaching, its always the human race that will bring it about and force Gods hand, some such as Hagee even pray to bring about WW3 so that  Christ has no choice but to return.
The two most well known stories of Judgment in the OT are Noahs flood, and Soddom and Gamorah. And in both stories God used natural forces that only He controls, that man has no control over whatsoever. The same when He judged Egypt before the Israelites Exodus. I think this is significant. When God chooses the time to end the world, to destroy all flesh, I believe He will not be relying on mere men to bring it about.   

dogcombat:
Hi all,

To understand "thief in the night",  let's take a closer look at 1 Thes. 5:2

2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

In light of what Kat posted from Mark 13, we see that "thief in the night" is a FIGURATIVE application.  Or a metaphor so to speak.  But, we read on in 2 Thes. 2 and find the following:

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Since God is the ONLY one who knows when Christ will return,  we are only to watch and wait.  Until then, there is much to endure until that time comes.  The phrase "for that day shall not come is written in italics by the translators.  Ray has expounded on this "Falling Away" in the "Who Is The Beast" paper.

               
                         THERE MUST COME A ‘FALLING AWAY’ FIRST

I have shown you that John, Paul, Peter, ALL of the apostles, the whole church in Asia, the Seven Churches of Revelation, the entire flock of God’s called, all built their houses upon spiritual sand—in other words EVERYONE ever called by God, falls, falls down, falls away.

The Proverb tells us that, "For a just man falls seven times…" That’s a COMPLETE fall. But strange as it may seem, this is necessary in God’s plan. What happens to a just man after he falls seven times? "…and RISES UP AGAIN" (Prov. 24:16). When he completely falls, he falls from grace. But for those whom God is both calling AND choosing, they will RISE UP AGAIN, for

"Who are you that judges another man’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Yes, he shall be holden up [made to stand up]: for God is able to MAKE HIM STAND" (Rom. 14:4).

We will ALL FALL! But afterwards, God "raises us UP AGAIN," and "makes us STAND." And from that time onward we have this sure promise of which we read before, but I want to read again:

"Now unto Him that is able to KEEP YOU FROM FALLING, and to present you FAULTLESS before the presence of His glory with EXCEEDING JOY, To the Only Wise God Our Saviour, be glory and majesty, and dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen" (Jude 124-25)!

When John’s spiritual house built upon the sand fell down, he was left, standing on the sand of the sea by himself alone with God, and it is then and only then, that he is able to see the wild beast that came up out of the sea.

He finishes the paper with the answer to WHO the Beast IS.  You can read it here

http://bible-truths.com/lake13.html

Hope this helps,
Ches

Martinez:

Hi dogcombat!

I don't think that thief in the night is just an expression here, our Lord has no idle words in His mouth.

Thief has a very significant meaning anywhere it is used, and remember that Christ was crucified between two thieves!

Thief here is a spiritual thing and it's something that Christ is not guilty of.

The question is spiritually, what is a thief?

dogcombat:
I think I should have clarified the FIGURATIVE application.  Since God is the ONLY one who knows when Jesus will return.  That will happen as "Thief In the Night".  Meaning, He will return when we're not expecting it.  The elect, who are living and endured the tribulation, won't be caught off guard, because they are being prepared for His glorious arrival.  Those who fell away, will be caught off guard.  Hope that helps

Ches

Beloved:
Jesus referring to Himself as a thief is certainly a Scriptural stumbling block for some. But there is no doubt that Jesus warned us all to stay awake and watch numerous times.

(Rev 3:3)  Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

He is telling us to remember how we Lambango (turned a 180 degrees and take in and hold what God revealed), and we are told to Tereo (this word was a major bone of contention in the past as older members may remember ...unlike what they said it does not mean DO ....it means guard keep your eyes on) and He says to repent (be humble and acknowledge our transgressions) 

But we know that this is all God's doing, He is the one who revealed Himself to us, we were blind. He is the one giving us the fortitude to watch and study. he is the one who is taking us through tribulations showing us the defects that are in our hearts and shows us the need to repent.

I am so glad to be out of Babylon and their preoccupation with end time theories. I am so sick of their  trying to outguess the Father by trying to predict the time of Jesus return. They just cannot accept what Jesus said himself. 

beloved

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