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Author Topic: death and dinosaurs  (Read 2747 times)

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dominian

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death and dinosaurs
« on: November 29, 2008, 04:22:33 PM »

Hello all,

For the past couple of days, I have been really interested in finding info on the dinosaurs. 
I had the pleasure of being a student of Dr Kurt Wise at Bryan College (a small christian liberal arts school).  For those who don't know who he is, he got his PHD at Harvard under Dr Gould.  He graduated #1 in his class.  I have to give it to him,  He's a very smart guy.  However, I wish I would of spent more time paying attention in his classes. He is a very big Creationist. 
I am now 31 and God opened my eyes to His truth about a year and a half ago.  My views on alot of things have changed since college, obviously!!!  I was reading an interview that he did, and he said that the dinosaurs had to of lived with man because before man sinned there would have been no death.
Thinking about that, he makes a very good point, because man's sin brought about death.  SO????!!!!!

Was wondering what you guys thought about that?  I currently believe that the universe and the earth are billions of years old and that God's view of time is much greater than ours. 

Could death have reigned even before man came on the scene??

Thank you
dominian
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Dave in Tenn

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2008, 07:49:45 PM »

He may be a very smart guy, but his views on both natural history and the spiritual meaning of death are lacking.  Check out those links that Beloved posted. 
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Heb 10:32  But you must continue to remember those earlier days, how after you were enlightened you endured a hard and painful struggle.

musicman

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2008, 10:11:53 PM »

Ditto.
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Ricky

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2008, 11:13:37 AM »

How is it possible for God to create all the beast of the world on the 6th day, and the dino`s are billions of years old? are dino`s beast`s, or butterflies? something does not make sense here, unless the 6 th day was billions of years ago. Why would God have dino`s here for any reason, and then sit around for billions of years watching them eat grass? Makes no sense. Dino`s and humans together, I could lol for hours at that thought.  And that is why the caveman could run 60 mph. Stuff like this just might be big illusion, and gives us the choice to chose between God or evolution. Even with lots of bones from dino`s, I am not convince they were ever here. God could have just made it look that way, dino`s, creators, etc. We will never know the answer.
        Ricky
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dominian

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2008, 12:27:40 PM »

Hello all

I looked at those notes and like i said, i believe that, but what about the issue of death.  How would use answer the question, How could death supreceed sin when death is a byproduct of man sin(the fall)?  Thanks for the notes links!!
dominian
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Beloved

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2008, 12:48:36 PM »

Dominion look at the actual verb in Genesis

(Gen 2:17)  and of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou dost not eat of it, for in the day of thine eating of it--dying thou dost die.'

Animals and plants and humans setainly died throughout the times of creation, and it appears that some had longer lifespans that what we see now.

Man then later put a limit on the human life span

Gen 6:3  And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be a hundred and twenty years.

The antiaging movement believes that living longer is possible if one has the genetics and can remove negative environmental effect...which is of course very difficult today because man keeps adding enormous amountst of environmemtal hazards in the name of progress.  The number od centarians has increased recently.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldest_people

I hope this helps

beloved
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2008, 01:29:09 PM »

Hi dominian

To add to Beloved's valuable post, I do not think that God's creation is something God is making up as He goes along. God knows the beginning from the end and God is not an idiot. Death was in the Mind of God before the Dinosaurs were created. All is out of God.

The first time death appeared in God's Mind or when or how that happened I do not know.
 
Death is not a separate entity but a consequence, result or effect that is in the Plan and Purpose of God.
 
You ask
Quote
Could death have reigned even before man came on the scene??

Death can not "reign." God reigns. Death is a consequence of sin, missing the mark, rebellion, arrogance and disobedience to say the least.

For Christ must reign until He humbles all His enemies beneath His feet. And the last enemy to be destroyed is death. For the Scriptures say " God has put all things under His authority. 1 Cor 15:25

I believe that God put all things under the authority of Christ from before Gen 1:1 and not during or after. Christ told us this when He stated that He lays His life down and no one takes it from Him because the Father has given Him the power to lay it down and take it up again.

To conclude that man coexisted with the dinosaurs based on the assumption that death did not exist earlier on does not address that Christ existed before Genesis 1:1 or that Adam and Eve may not have been the first humans or what Science has discovered. Who was Cain afraid of? When did God the Father give His Son the power over death? Was it before the dinosaurs existed or after?

Have you listened to Ray's latest Conference audio?

Arc
 
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dominian

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2008, 04:06:23 PM »

Guys thanks for your reply's but your not answering my question.  If i am to believe that Adam and Eve were the first man that God created, and it was becuase of their disobedience that sin entered the world.  And also that death is a consequence of sin.  How could the dinosaurs have expirenced the consequences of man's sin millions of years prior to them even exisiting? 
If death is the consequence of our sin.  Death has to follow sin not proceed it.

If we are saying that man was already dying even before they sinned (Gen2:17) then death was not a consequence of their sin.  But Romans 6:23 says the wages of sin is death.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2008, 04:11:41 PM by dominian »
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Craig

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2008, 05:04:02 PM »

Drop it folks.  You are asking questions that nobody can answer.  We can all have our ideas but it is speculation, nowhere are there 100 scriptures to back up our opinions on the matter. 

Craig
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Ninny

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2008, 05:13:07 PM »

Thank you, Craig you are right! I think it's a dead-end road! :-\
Kathy :)
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dominian

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2008, 06:10:16 PM »

Wow!!!!
To say to drop it, thats a typical "Christian" answer. 
I think this is a great question and deserves some discussion.  Its a good point if we are to take the bible as without error.  I agree that there is no way that we can limit God's timetable to 6000 yrs, so if thats the case how does death fit in, if we say that death started as a consequnce to man's sin.

Not trying to be difficult but I just was looking for a good discussion.  I think it is good to challenge our beliefs.  If we never challenged them, I'm sure most of us would never have come to believe in God's beautiful picture of Grace. 
Challenges makes you stronger!!!  So lets think this one thru and come up with some GOOD answers!!!

dominian
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Craig

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Re: death and dinosaurs
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2008, 06:18:44 PM »

Then Mr. Dominian, you need to take some time to re-read the forum rules you agreed to when you joined.

And no, challenge does not necessarily make you stronger.  Many times it leads to carnal thoughts and opinion and senseless babblings.  Rather than trying to make the scripture say things that are not there, we all should be getting to the meat of the scripture and striving to have our beast die and Christ to live in us.  But that isn't as fun is it? 
 
Craig
« Last Edit: November 30, 2008, 06:22:33 PM by Craig »
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