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Born out of Water
Phil3:10:
Kat, Marques, and all,
Thanks so very much for your input. I so agree that we are not in any way spiritual. All mankind is but flesh and can only obey GOD as HE directs our life in HIS way and in HIS time frame. I think this is one of the major faults of the church system. They attempt to be spiritual not realizing the impossibility of being spiritual in this fleshly body. GOD elects, HE calls, HE chooses and HE saves. AL glory and praise to HIM who is all in all.
Phil3:10
Mc_Can:
Thanks Marques for your thorough response. I hope you got your breath back without too much trouble. :)
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: Mc_Can on December 15, 2008, 12:59:35 PM ---Thanks Marques for your thorough response. I hope you got your breath back without too much trouble. :)
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LOL :D
Yea, I need to learn to take a 'chill-pill' sometimes... :D
Marques
aqrinc:
Marques,
You hit the nail on the head with that one, glad it didn't nick your finger. Those chill pills work too,
this is hard work just staying on track, i am still looking for the spiritual witness for born of the womb (water).
It is not there because you already stated what the Scriptures Say re: that subject.
george. ;D
--- Quote from: mharrell08 on December 15, 2008, 10:08:54 AM ---
--- Quote from: Mc_Can on December 15, 2008, 08:03:57 AM ---
Hello Mike,
You are correct in stating how the physical is first and then the spiritual. However, being 'born of water' are 'words of spirit' and is not referring to being born in a womb or being physically baptized.
As you referenced the 12 spiritual truths to understanding His Word, recall the principle of comparing spiritual with spiritual to come to a spiritual match:
From email reply from Ray (http://bible-truths.com/email3.htm#baptism):
Throughout the New Testament the apostles teach us concerning the "water and the blood." Here is what the water and the blood symbolize and what they do FOR US:
"...the WASHING [spiritual water] OF REGENERATION, and renewing of the Holy Spirit; which He shed [poured out] on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour" (Titus 3:5b-6).
"That He might sanctify and cleanse it [the church, ver. 25] with the washing of water BY THE WORD" (Eph. 5:36).
Can we not see that the water IS THE WORD of God? Do we get SPIRITUAL clean by being baptized in PHYSICAL WATER? What have we just read? "...washing of water BY THE WORD." Here's a second witness:
"Now ye are clean [washed clean] through the WORD which I have spoken unto you" (John 15:3).
Being born of water represents being sanctified by His Word. For those who believe that when Christ stated 'born of water' he was referring to the physical and then referenced the spiritual when he stated 'and of spirit' is equivalent to Christ explaining a parable which He never did with the multitude or even Nicodemus who He was speaking with in John 3.
We are currently being (an on-going process) sanctified by His Word in this present age. But no one is born of the spirit in this age...that happens at the resurrection:
Excerpt from LOF 16 D4 (http://bible-truths.com/lake16-D4.htm):
"That which is born of the flesh [that's all of us] IS FLESH [that too is all of us] and that which is born of the Spirit [are we now born of the Spirit? NO, and here's why...] ...that which is born of the Spirit IS SPIRIT" (John 3:6). Is anyone human flesh and at the same time SPIRIT? No, I think not. Jesus adds more proof of what it is like to be "born of the Spirit" - "The wind [Gk: pneuma-'spirit'] blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound thereof, but can not tell whence it comes, or whether it goes: so is everyone that is BORN of the Spirit" (Verse 8 ). Right there are three reasons why no one except Jesus has been born of the Spirit: [1] We are not composed of spirit, [2] We are not powerful like the wind, [3] Neither are we invisible like the wind.
And so, we as Believers as "conceived" by the Spirit of God and have the "earnest" of His Spirit (Eph. 1:14), but we will not be born again (or anew) until we are resurrected with "incorruptible, glorified, powerful, SPIRITUAL bodies" - like the WIND (I Cor. 15:42-44).
Christ says one must be both 'born of water' (sanctified by His Word) and 'born of spirit' (born anew with spiritual bodies at resurrection) to enter the Kingdom. Do we think we do not have to be sanctified by His Word and only born from the womb? Do we think we can be sanctified by the Word and not born anew in the spirit? Do you see why BOTH are necessary? How can we put on incorruption (born anew in spirit) if we not been sanctified (born of water) which is to make pure and holy?
Does anyone have any spiritual witnesses that born of water is born of the womb...that Christ was being literal when he stated this...that this was one instance where Christ was NOT speaking a parable? 'Born of water' is spiritual as is 'Born of spirit'...Ray explains this clearly.
Alright, I need to take a breath... :D :D
Marques
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