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Church today...
David:
Here in Britain most Churches only keep prayer and service books, the reason is that those books are of no value other than for the services. Churches in the past that did keep Bibles ended up having them all stolen, and so they no longer keep them but encourage worshippers to bring them along.
My local cathedral has a shop that sells numerous English versions for none profit.
aqrinc:
Sorry to be the grinch but the reason we are here is because we have been pulled from there.
Hope to get your attention; why do we keep going back to where we have been dragged from.
Revelation of John 14:8:
And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she
made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
Revelation of John 18:2:
And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become
the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
Revelation of John 18:4:
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that you be not partakers
of her sins, and that you receive not of her plagues.
george. :( :'(
Fester:
--- Quote from: aqr on December 27, 2008, 05:44:20 PM ---
Sorry to be the grinch but the reason we are here is because we have been pulled from there.
Hope to get your attention; why do we keep going back to where we have been dragged from.
Revelation of John 14:8:
And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she
made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
Revelation of John 18:2:
And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become
the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
Revelation of John 18:4:
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that you be not partakers
of her sins, and that you receive not of her plagues.
george. :( :'(
--- End quote ---
Well George, I see it a little differently. My wife and children love to go to church (Baptist) and are all caught up in it. I go with them as we are family, and as such, we try and do things together. I print off a few of Ray's papers and read them during the service. It is great reading time! So although I am physically in church I do not partake of her. I speak with my family now and then about the things that I have learned but I do not force it on them. I hope those little seeds will grow within them. Coming to the truth was a process for me and I realize that it will be for them as well. So spiritually I am out of her and hope to rescue my family from her too. Hopefully, the day will come where we will just stay home and study as a family. So we cannot just think of ourselves all the time but our loved ones as well. So let's not be too harsh on the church goers as they may also have reasons valid to them to still attend. Plus we don't know where they are in their spiritual development/learning. But we do know God will pull us out at His appointed time.
Wes
P.S. They don't have Bibles in the pews but do have a few spares for those who may request one.
aqrinc:
Hi Wes,
My point is not to those that are still lost but those who now understand; or maybe
The Scriptures do not mean what i think they mean?. They have not been pulled out;
we however have acknowledged that we have been pulled or dragged out. As one
called and professing to understand the Scriptures in a new and much clearer way, it
is incumbent on us to be the Light without going back to our old comfort zone. Love is
not a conditional thing in its truest form, we must love all humanity regardless but we
were not taken out of Babylon physically or Spiritually just for the moment.
When God Calls one out the beginning of separation from the world starts, so if that
first step was coming out of Babylon Spiritually why go back? This is a very difficult
walk and many hard decisions must be made daily until we learn to Really Love.
Here is an excerpt from: The Topic Love.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3719.msg27958.html#msg27958
So this is the manner in which God loves the world, with agapao love. A love that is undeserved, they’re not reciprocating, ok. Let me give you another example of agapao love, not phileo love. Agapao love is when they crucified Christ, and He was dying, He prayed to His Father and said, “Father forgive them, for they don’t know what they are doing.” (Luke 23:34) Now that’s agape love.
Father these people are blind and deceived, oh they’re fools, and they’re hypocrites, blind fools as they called the Pharisees in Matt 23, none the less. Then as it was such a strong condemnation, on the one hand, on the other hand, He says Father forgive them. Is this a contradiction? No, it’s not. It’s the way God is and we need to be like God, ok.
We can love our neighbor, with a agape love, we don’t need to fellowship, hobnob with them or become part of what they are, in any way, shape or form. When God says, love your enemies. If it said you would have to phileo your enemies, then I would just have to take my 9 pages of notes here, tear them up, throw them away. Close the Bible and say, I have not a clue as to what this thing about love is, not a clue.
But I have checked it out for many, many hours now, and I understand that the Bible does not contradict in this area. God - Jesus Christ, never said you have heard, them of old say, you should hate your enemies.
First of all, God never taught to hate your enemies. Well, where did they hear that of old? About five times in the book of Psalms, by David, who went to his death bed hating his enemies, telling his son to kill them and make it bloody. That was King David, not God. But people read the Psalms and so you heard it said. Yes, you did hear it said, but not of God.
But Christ said, but I say unto you, love your enemies - agapao your enemies. Can you love your enemies and hate them at the same time? Well, you say no you can’t, that’s a contradiction. Well, let’s think about that for a second. Could God hate Esau and love him a the same time? Not only could He, the Bible tells us that, and it shows that He did. He shows more favor to Jacob then He did for Esau, and yet you can find some pretty strong promises and blessings (even though He said I hate Esau), you can find blessings on Esau in the Bible I can show you them, ok.
God said, I hate liars and people that cause discord and everything, yet I gave My own Son for the world. Why?, because I agapao them.
God thinks beyond their couple of three score and ten years of hate and criminality. I look beyond that, and I see their future - agapao. Maybe we need to learn to do that too. If we’re going to be like God, right.
george. :( :)
Fester:
--- Quote from: aqr on December 27, 2008, 08:56:41 PM ---
When God Calls one out the beginning of separation from the world starts, so if that
first step was coming out of Babylon Spiritually why go back? This is a very difficult
walk and many hard decisions must be made daily until we learn to Really Love.
--- End quote ---
I am out of "Babylon Spiritually" and do not partake of her just as we are instructed to do in the scriptures. The scriptures are SPIRITUAL not physical and I am spiritually out. Yet I still physically attend for the reasons I listed above. Church is far from a comfort zone for me. However, physically we still have to live in this world. It truly is a difficult walk. Since learning the truth I have come to 'Really Love' my family more than I ever have in the past.
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