> General Discussions
Life Issues/Trials?
EKnight:
Since I have been here at BT I have come to the understanding that "the called" are tried and tested here on earth and those that endure or overcome to the end are the chosen.
My question is, how does one differentiate between being tried and just plain and simply experiencing life's difficulties. For instance, people's loved ones get sick and die, or they have financial troubles, or marital difficulties or family issues, and the list goes on. But these things happen to believers and non-believers alike. And most people will live through it.
Through the eyes of a believer, these things are trials but to non-believers they are but life's woes. So, what's the difference? Or, what difference does it make?
Eileen
aqrinc:
Hi Eileen,
Ray has written some on this subject, he quotes: Ecc 1:13 several times. That Scripture is not in isolation by any means, below are what i understand to be Spiritual matches for that quote. Notice that The Scriptures Say; this experience is given to the sons of humanity.
An experience of evil is for everyone, since we are the sons of humanity; (all of us have to learn), even the current blind and deaf.
Ecc 1:13 (KJV)
I applied my heart to inquiring and exploring by wisdom concerning all that is done under the heavens:it is an experience of evil Elohim has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it.
Witness #1
Ecc 3: 10-11 (CLV)
10 I see the experience that Elohim gives To the sons of humanity to humble them by it.
11 He has made everything fitting in its season; However, He has put obscurity in their heart So that the man may not find out His work, That which the One, Elohim, does from the beginning to the terminus."
Witness #2
Ecc 4:8 (CLV)
There was one person, but there was no second; There even was no son or brother for him; Also there was no end to all his toil, Yet his eyes were not satisfied with his riches. Then he said, For whom am I toiling And making my soul lack good? This too is vanity, and it is an experience of evil."
Witness #3
Ecc 8: 11-17 (CLV)
11 Because there is no sentence executed quickly against the evil deed, Therefore the heart of the sons of humanity in them is fully given to do evil."
12 Though a sinner does a hundred evils and days are prolonged for him, Yet I know that good shall come to those fearful of the One, Elohim, Who fear before Him."
13 Yet good shall not come to the wicked one, Nor shall he prolong his days like a shadow, Because there is no fear before Elohim."
14 There is another vanity that is done on the earth:There are righteous men for whom retribution is according to the work of the wicked, And there are wicked ones for whom retribution is according to the work of the righteous; I say that this too is vanity."
15 So I lauded rejoicing, Since there is no good for a man under the sun Save to eat and to drink and to rejoice. And it shall lodge with him in his toil through the days of his life, Which the One, Elohim, gives to him under the sun."
16 When I applied my heart to know wisdom, And to see the experience that is appointed on earth (For both by day and night, there is no seeing of sleep for Him with His eyes),
17 Then I saw in all the work of the One, Elohim, That a man is not able to find out the work that is done under the sun, Forasmuch as a man may toil in seeking it out but shall not find it; And even if a wise man says he knows, he is not able to find it out."
All these witnesses and there are more in this book alone, hope you find your answer right in these Scriptures.
george. :)
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: EKnight on May 06, 2009, 07:42:37 PM ---Since I have been here at BT I have come to the understanding that "the called" are tried and tested here on earth and those that endure or overcome to the end are the chosen.
My question is, how does one differentiate between being tried and just plain and simply experiencing life's difficulties. For instance, people's loved ones get sick and die, or they have financial troubles, or marital difficulties or family issues, and the list goes on. But these things happen to believers and non-believers alike. And most people will live through it.
Through the eyes of a believer, these things are trials but to non-believers they are but life's woes. So, what's the difference? Or, what difference does it make?
Eileen
--- End quote ---
Hello Eileen,
All is of God...so all trials, tribulations, 'life issues', etc. come from God. They are to humble us, build character, love, patience, etc.
The Elect/Chosen come to a knowledge and understanding of this throughout their lifetime...for others, they either fall away, become led to deception, go back into the world, or they never come out of the world and/or church to begin with.
In the categorized list of Ray's email responses, check out the sections titled 'Repentance' & 'Overcoming' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3108.0.html)...these may help as well.
Hope this helps,
Marques
EKnight:
Hi Marques and George,
The scriptures and ideals presented by both of you are only beneficial to believers. A non-believer does not read scripture. Sure, from where I sit, I can see God's handiwork but for a person just living life, what is the point of their suffering? What do they learn?
Most of these scriptures talk of evil. To me, evil is beheading american journalists in the middle east, or molesting and murdering children, or raping women in a public forum as an act of war etc etc. But losing a loved one, or marital woes and all those other things I previously mentioned, is not evil to me. Those are just things that most people will experience in their lifetime. We here at BT would call them trials sometimes.
What are the benefits to these life trials for non-believers? I know good people who suffer but God is not in the picture for them. So scripture is meaningless or even non-existent to them.
I look around me and see people just living their lives day to day and wonder how God effects their lives if they don't believe. ??? ??? ???
I hope I am getting my point across. :-\
Eileen
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: EKnight on May 06, 2009, 09:29:51 PM ---Hi Marques and George,
The scriptures and ideals presented by both of you are only beneficial to believers. A non-believer does not read scripture. Sure, from where I sit, I can see God's handiwork but for a person just living life, what is the point of their suffering? What do they learn?
Most of these scriptures talk of evil. To me, evil is beheading american journalists in the middle east, or molesting and murdering children, or raping women in a public forum as an act of war etc etc. But losing a loved one, or marital woes and all those other things I previously mentioned, is not evil to me. Those are just things that most people will experience in their lifetime. We here at BT would call them trials sometimes.
What are the benefits to these life trials for non-believers? I know good people who suffer but God is not in the picture for them. So scripture is meaningless or even non-existent to them.
I look around me and see people just living their lives day to day and wonder how God effects their lives if they don't believe. ??? ??? ???
I hope I am getting my point across. :-\
Eileen
--- End quote ---
Yes, you are getting your point across but it seems mine got lost somewhere:
--- Quote from: mharrell08 on May 06, 2009, 09:12:25 PM ---All is of God...so all trials, tribulations, 'life issues', etc. come from God. They are to humble us, build character, love, patience, etc.
--- End quote ---
Whether someone knows 'all is of God' or not is irrelevant...all circumstances, situations, experiences, etc come from God. These all help build and mold everyone's character...we see these results in each other's lives.
Think of the many, many people we know in our lives that has experienced a death of a friend or family member...these same people show a greater appreciation for life in almost all those cases, even if temporary. Now then, how many of those know spiritual truths of God's word? Very few if any...
Character building is character building...doesn't matter if the person knows where it's coming from...they will soon enough, in this age or the next.
Thanks,
Marques
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