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Abu Musab al-Zarqawi Killed in Iraq
Alan:
Hello everyone.....
Instead of making replies to every post, I will just make one more to make this clear........(as in a 2nd admonition)
Tit 3:10 A man that is a heretic after the first and second admonition reject;
Tit 3:11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
Loving your enemies is cut and dry, as are all of Christ's commandments.
There is no room for negotiation on these words of Christ!
These words mean nothing to the many called and all the unbelievers in this world. The reason being is because they are spiritual words.
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
1Co 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
These people of the world hate God and His word.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
God works all things according to the counsel of His will, which means His will is done in every persons life, whether they are His Elect, many called or still in unbelief.
Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Mat 13:15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
God ordains these leaders to do His will, but that does not mean that He lives inside of them.
2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
Our cares are not of this world, but of spiritual things!
Mat 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
Mat 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.
These leaders in authority, being either of the church or state, are the Pharisees of today. Christ submitted to these authorities, only when it didn't conflict with His law........as in the Sabbath......etc...
It is the same for us today.
We, as in the true followers of Christ and His doctrine have a higher standard of law that we are to obey without exception. We should never give in to the killing of anyone, be it in war....death penalty....etc.
Loving our enemies means LOVING OUR ENEMIES........NO EXCEPTION.
For everyone quoting the old law and using it as support for the killing of human life..........
We are not under the law of Moses anymore and the things that happen back then were the law.
We are under new law.....the LAW OF CHRIST and all of those that lived before Christ did not receive the promises of grace.
Heb 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
There will always be wars and killing in this age, but for the true followers of Christ, we are not to approve or contribute to these things.
Christ's law is not for the many called and unbelievers. To be an overcomer, we must adhere to the spiritual law.
Someone brought up this scripture......
Luk 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.
Luk 22:37 For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.
Luk 22:38 And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.
These words are spiritual, not physical.
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
Mar 4:13 And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables?
Everything Christ taught was spiritual, and this is no exception.
Here is another translation from the GNB
Luk 22:38 The disciples said, "Look! Here are two swords, Lord!" "That is enough!" he replied.
I believe Jesus reprimanded them as saying ENOUGH OF THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They couldn't see what Christ was saying anymore than that of the parables. Just like when Christ told Peter.....get thee behind me Satan.
Mat 16:23.
But, even if we look at this in the literal (physical sense), why would Jesus say "It is enough" when there were more than two disciples there and they only had two swords? Jesus said this at the Last Supper when all were present!
This sword is a spiritual one. Notice the reference to the buying and selling here. Sell your cloak.......buy a sword. The sword is THE TRUTH, and the disciples knew what Christ meant when He opened up to them..the scriptures.
Read this e-mail that Mike wrote on the subject!
http://www.*not-allowed*.com/takingarms.php
........................................................................................................
Yellowstone,
I'm not here to pick on you, but I have to address the scripture you keep refering to......
Lets look at scripture surrounding this verse you keep bringing up.
1Jo 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
1Jo 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
1Jo 3:12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
1Jo 3:13 Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
1Jo 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
1Jo 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
1Jo 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
1Jo 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jo 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
What John is saying here is what Christ told us!
We are to LOVE everyone, including helping our fellow man by having compassion for them, even though God has blinded their hearts.
We know that we have passed from death unto life when we can love our brother (neighbor) as we love ourselves.
The laying down our lives for our brother is not a reason to go against the Law of Christ, but it is our duty to stand for the TRUTH. That's what we give our lives for.............just as it is with the shadow and type of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego in Daniel.
This is the spiritual warfare I am talking about. Not some physical war.
All of these political people running this country are already dead, but God is using them for His ultimate purpose, just like our military.
My only concern in this age is to love my brother, and that means everyone in this entire world, but I don't let them into my spiritual house and entertain their heresy.
So I post these scriptures again to all who support retaliation of terrorism and war!
2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
2Jo 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed:
2Jo 1:11 For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds.
Love your enemies and obey the doctrine of Christ!
In Christ,
Alan
hillsbororiver:
Al-Zarqawi did his part in fulfilling scripture, with a slightly different twist;
Mat 26:52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
He lived by the bomb and died by the bomb.
I am very hesitant to believe or root for the liberal or conservative worldly causes, it is written;
Joh 8:23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
Joh 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
We are His servants are we not? So let's not worry about who or what worldly, beastly government is "right," they are all wrong, none of them are here for more than a short time, remember;
Mat 11:30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.
Let's put our faith in Him, believe what He says about our burdon being light, He will sort it all out.
How can anyone here say with any certainty whether Saddam had WMD or not? It is a matter of faith, some prefer to believe Saddam over Bush but how can anyone be certain? He sure acted like he had weapons, why didn't he give the inspectors access? That was his mistake.
How much sympathy does someone deserve who waves an empty gun at the cops when a SWAT team is surrounding them? If they choose to threaten when they could have submitted.
Yes, it is trendy to trash Blair and Bush, but are we to follow worldly trends? It is also justifiable to many to want to see the terrorists crash and burn. How about praying that your family and loved ones are kept safe and have faith in Him to bring it all to a glorious conclusion.
Peace,
Joe
YellowStone:
--- Quote from: Alan ---Yellowstone,
I'm not here to pick on you, but I have to address the scripture you keep refering to......
Lets look at scripture surrounding this verse you keep bringing up.
1Jo 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
1Jo 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
1Jo 3:12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
1Jo 3:13 Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
1Jo 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
1Jo 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
1Jo 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
1Jo 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jo 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
What John is saying here is what Christ told us!
We are to LOVE everyone, including helping our fellow man by having compassion for them, even though God has blinded their hearts.
We know that we have passed from death unto life when we can love our brother (neighbor) as we love ourselves.
This is the spiritual warfare I am talking about. Not some physical war.
All of these political people running this country are already dead, but God is using them for His ultimate purpose, just like our military.
My only concern in this age is to love my brother, and that means everyone in this entire world, but I don't let them into my spiritual house and entertain their heresy.
So I post these scriptures again to all who support retaliation of terrorism and war!
2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
2Jo 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed:
2Jo 1:11 For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds.
Love your enemies and obey the doctrine of Christ!
In Christ,
Alan
--- End quote ---
Alan
You raise some intersting points and I thank you for sharing your view and the additional scriptures.
I think the following scripture is the one causing contention (in good faith) between us.
1Jo 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
And you correctly state:
--- Quote ---What John is saying here is what Christ told us!
We are to LOVE everyone, including helping our fellow man by having compassion for them, even though God has blinded their hearts.
--- End quote ---
Then you say:
--- Quote ---All of these political people running this country are already dead, but God is using them for His ultimate purpose, just like our military.
--- End quote ---
Alan, this is perhaps the most pompous statement that I have heard on this forum. Are you God? You are absolutely certain that God has written every soldier off, and in no way could possibly be teaching each of them things that even we do not know.
May I ask you a question? Are you free of sin? For you know that whoever sins is of the devil. Can you say that this is not true. Satan has a very strong hold on the entire world and me.
1Jo 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. [/list:u]
But we are not without hope, for we have the love of Jesus Christ and the comforter that intercedes for us.
Jhn 14:26 But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. [/list:u]
And he pleads and begs for us;
Rom 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. [/list:u]
Without a doubt, even though we are sinners still, we do have a greater hope with the spirit than those who the spirit knows not.
Jam 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. [/list:u]
James conveys this very well in the scripture above. Without the spirit our body is dead! No turning away from that one. But is that all that is needed. Not according to the latter portion of that scripture, for it continues on saying: Faith without works is dead.
Are these physical works or spiritual works; would you believe both. Jesus spent the latter portion of his life helping the sick and dying. He loved them and he went to their aid, many by their faith were healed by it alone. To say that once we have the spirit, we must only concern ourselves with spiritual matters, is only a half truth. For we are commanded that:
1Jo 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither with the tongue; but in deed and truth.[/list:u]
Our physical actions must match our words, both in deed and truth.
Likewise:
Rom 13:1 Let every soul be in subjection to the higher powers: for there is no power but of God; and the powers that be are ordained of God.
Rom 13:2 Therefore he that resisteth the power, withstandeth the ordinance of God: and they that withstand shall receive to themselves judgment.
Rom 13:3 For rulers are not a terror to the good work, but to the evil. And wouldest thou have no fear of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise from the same:
Rom 13:4 for he is a minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is a minister of God, an avenger for wrath to him that doeth evil. [/list:u]
Would you prefer that terrorists be given free reign to terrorize at whim? Would you prefer that our "dead" soldiers stay at home, would you take comfort in seeing millions perish under unceasing attacks?
Alan, you cannot have the spiritual without the physical. Read again Romans 3:13 - For rulers are not a terror to the good work, but to the evil. And wouldest thou have no fear of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise from the same:[\b]
We who live in the US and other Western nations are truly blessed. We can help millions by stopping a relative few. But you continue to use the word "HATE." I do not see it my friend, I do not have it, feel it or see it; rather I see love and compassion for the very little ones who are unable to help themselves. We can help them and we do. Why?
Perhaps it is just as we are commanded to do: But you say these people who are ordained by God are "dead." Are they any greater sinners than you? I mean that in all honesty, are they greater sinners than you. They are however obeying one of Jesus Commandments:
Rom 13:1 Let every soul be in subjection to the higher powers: for there is no power but of God; and the powers that be are ordained of God. [/list:u]
And in doing so, are helping there fellow brothers and sisters, for failing to do so is clearly ignoring God's word.
1Jo 3:17 But whoso hath the world’s goods, and beholdeth his brother in need, and shutteth up his compassion from him, how doth the love of God abide in him? [/list:u]
Do you really disdain, helping those who are unable to help themselves. We are commanded to Alan, doing nothing is not enough. Please read and understand Jesus' words.
Mat 25:42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Mat 25:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Mat 25:45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me. [/list:u]
This teaching is both spiritual and physical. Do you not see the connection? We are commanded to help and protect:
Jhn 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. [/list:u]
Do you still believe that our soldiers are "dead" that our "Government" is dead also. Are they greater sinners than any one reading this?
Remember, each of who has God in our hearts and souls have a personal relationship with him. Who can say what goes between God and anyone of his subjects. Alan, neither you or I.
But we do know this; We have the great comforter interceding for us (Rom 8:26) and who knows what the "groanings which cannot be uttered." truly are.
Alan, our relationships with God and Christ is personal, I think you are wrong telling me that our soldiers and authorities are "dead." This is not for any other than God to know.
I don't hate Bin Laden, in fact I hope and pray that he will surrender and denounce Islam.
God Bless,
YellowStone
Alan:
Yellowstone,
First off, I don't feel I'm being pompous, but standing on the Word of God.
I am not God!!!!!!!!!!!!!.......but,
1Co 2:16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Rom 15:6 That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
This is Paul talking to God's Elect.
To be of one mind, we have to know the truth! This is what we strive for.
What you are saying about love in deed and truth is the truth, but I believe there is nothing done physically without being spiritual.
As I quoted before......
Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
No man can love with God's love without His Spirit.
This is what Christ told us about the many called.............
Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
So if this is the many called, then the unbeliever will definitely be told to depart.
I'm putting this down to show you that, once again, it's all spiritual.
Many can do good works, such as.....
1Jo 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither with the tongue; but in deed and truth.
If the Father and the Son live in us, then the physicality of good works will definitely happen. We will be like and have the mind of Christ.
Jam 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
Faith is of God, so will be our works.
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
This is the sovereignty of God.....
Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
His good pleasure is for all mankind!
I think the difference here is the understanding of God's will.
What God wills in the natural man is different that what He wills in His elect.
God would not will one of His elect to go and break the commandments of Christ, but He would will the natural man to do His work, just as He uses Satan to do His work in this world. The natural man abides by the law of Moses, and sometimes not even that.
So, with me, myself, following the commandments of Christ, I do not agree with what is going on in this world. We are not to be part of this world, but we have to live here, and by living here, we follow Christ's example and love in deed and truth. This is done by the Father and the Son living in us!
I hope you understand what I'm saying.
When I say that the authorities and personal of our government are dead, I mean exactly that. I'm not playing God at all, but I'm showing you the difference between the natural man and the elect.
Anyone that is going against the doctrine of Christ is the spritually dead.
Joh 8:51 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see (spiritual) death.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
1Jo 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
The scriptures you use to prove your point in Romans 13 are what most of Babylon uses to support their belief in war, along with the law of Moses.
To end this, yes I am a sinner!
But with Father and the Son living in me, I have dominion over sin.
Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
It is my hope that you see what is written here.
All of God's will is being done. He does not contradict and when He says...
Love thy enemies......He is speaking to His elect and not the natural man who He has hardened their hearts. I just believe that the scriptures tell us that he who does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have the Father or the Son living in him.
This is truth and the sum of His word tells us this!
In Christ,
Alan
eutychus:
post all yall what.
here is truth, do i please men?
Zarky died at his appointed time.
God is in control
unseen lives are saved.
for what ever reason God wants.
his will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
All Glory and honour to CHRIST.
creator and substaner of ALL things.
love
euty.
Col 3:2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
Isa 40:26 Lift up your eyes on high, and behold who hath created these [things], that bringeth out their host by number: he calleth them all by names by the greatness of his might, for that [he is] strong in power; not one faileth
Pro 3:5 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
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