How does God transform us within ?

[mrsnacks]

Another new post .

Going to church gives me a lot of material to work with (smile) .

I hear so much from the pulpit of the need for the Christian to get into the Word. To spend quiet time with the Lord. To stop doing this and that and start doing things that are pleasing to God.

And I get the sense that Christian life is nothing more than overcoming and conquering the flesh with God's help. In a sense all this is true. But you walk out feeling like life is just one test after another. Life is showing you how much you need to get your act together with God's help.  Then dealing with crises and conflicts that are molding us and building us into Christ likeness. Christians  deep inside - are unhappy people. They smile and say they have joy but it is a fake in many. Sort of like when you are embarrassed when you fall down accidentally in public and someone says "are you alright?" - You are hurting but you say "I am okay ."

But the Word clearly says God is in charge of our sanctification. He is the one performing the work in us. So these struggles in our lives are there for a reason and some things take time. But I would think He will transform the areas in our lives in His own time right ? So we should not be all frustrated when we have these areas that need transforming. He is transforming us. He is in charge. In making us the kind of people who live the Christ life naturally. It must flow out of us naturally. Sort of like I don't do drugs , get drunk ,or act unlovingly to someone not because it is a God's law but because He has transformed me into the kind of person who doesn't desire to do these things.

So the sermons each week are sort of like the long lectures my dad gave me growing up. I would say " here he goes again with the lecture."   

[Robin]

I always think of it as circumcision. The flesh is not transformed, it is cut away. I think that's where I have the biggest problem with that teaching. Everyone is trying to make the flesh good flesh instead of having their heart circumcised. The carnal has to die. It cannot change into something good.

[Kat]

Hi M.G.,

That is a very good point you made.

mrsnacks you were saying how going to church gives you things to work with, and;

Christians  deep inside - are unhappy people. They smile and say they have joy but it is a fake in many.

This is what Christ said about the church leaders.

Mat 15:7  You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said:
v. 8  "'This people honors Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me;
v. 9  in vain do they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.'"
v. 10  And He called the people to Him and said to them, "Hear and understand:
v. 11  it is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a person, but what comes out of the mouth; this defiles a person."
v. 12  Then the disciples came and said to Him, "Do you know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?"
v. 13  He answered, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be rooted up.
v. 14  Let them alone; they are blind guides. And if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit."

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[mrsnacks]

Interesting thing stuck out in that verse. The blind can only lead those that are blind. The ones that see don't follow those that are blind. Therefore we don't fall into the pit.

Good point MG about the flesh. So what is transformed or needs to be ?

[DuluthGA]

Hello Brother Snacks, I sort of "see" your question within your thoughts.   

I will tell you my first-off response, and it is simple:  I am getting ready to become a spiritual being.  All the physical stuff is going to get hung up, and yes, 'You-Know-Who' IS IN CHARGE of this process.

So I definitely agree, "we should not at all get frustrated when we have these areas (in our lives) that need transforming."  HE IS TRANSFORMING US.

With what we've already been Given, can we not always ask for more (of His Spirit)?  Are we all not G-R-O-W-I-N-G?  I am with you in spirit...

Take care, Caregiver

[Chris R]

God is creating sons, it is a process, all will come to know the truth [Isa 26:9]
So that God may be ALL in ALL [Cor 15:28]


1Cr 15:19  If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

So yes God transforms us, ALL of us..some sooner than others.

Peace

Chris R

[dogcombat]

Good point, 

I think the question becomes:  "Would you like to live a Christian life? or Would you like to live Life in Christ?"   The former is our feeble attempts to please God in our flesh (which "Profits Nothing" John 6:63).  While the latter is being led by the Spirit to do "good works that God has foreordained us to walk in" (Ephesians 2:10).  Mrsnacks point about christian being "unhappy people" who basically put on a brave front is telling.  For it reflects the efforts of a "Christian Life". 

On the other hand those who walk after the Spirit don't have to put on such a front.  Because His glorious light shines in the midst of the darkness called life.

Just my 2 and a half cents
Ches

[mrsnacks]

Good points. I wonder about our own blind spots. We all have them. We can see faults and flaws in other people. I am not talking about judging. But when it comes to us we seem to be blind.

My wife sees some of my blind spots. Times where I think my marriage is fine and I am giving her loving care and support- and then she comes up with telling me in a loving way that I haven't hugged her or touched her for a day or two or that I seem to be off in another world not showing her I care.

I want to be transformed but it seems that life here is just scratching the surface as I see most people in the latter years still with the same carnal self. Is our growth in Him so small in our years here ? I get impatient and say to God that He is infinite and eternal- He has all the time in the world . We only have a short time here and why does He take so long or move so slow with us ?

[dogcombat]

Mrsnacks,

I see where you're going.  Until God, through His spirit "reveals" our sins, we won't be able to see them.  Much like Adam & Eve.  They were ALREADY naked, but were not made aware of it until they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.  Ray spoke of how he was brought to repent for "leaving his first love" (I believe at the Nashville conference) in how bibletruths.com got started.  Many are blind to the fact that they have left their "first love" until God brings that understanding to them.

As we grow in our walk with God, He will show us what we are blind to by giving us "eyes to see".  Until then, we won't "get it". 

Ches

[carol70]

Many are called, few are chosen...and not everyone is called.

So the ones who are never called live in the same carnality all the days of their lives, right?

I don't think our growth in Him is small.  When I was 17 I told my mom I was done with church, that I saw no reason to go.  When I was 27 I felt God calling me back into the church.  And now, at 37, He's called me out of the church.  My growth in Him has been nothing short of miraculous, yet I still have such a long way to go.

Apparently, this process of circumcising the flesh can't happen overnight.  I mean it could, if God chose it to be that way, but I guess He has His reasons for taking His time. 

[mrsnacks]

But is this the case for example with God using my wife to tell me where I have gone astray? Doesn't God speaks through people  right? Then even when someone says something or points something out, I still repeat and walk like I am blind. It is like a child. Sometimes you have to tell them "no" or "don't " quite a few times until they get it.

[mrsnacks]

Many are called, few are chosen...and not everyone is called.

So the ones who are never called live in the same carnality all the days of their lives, right?

I don't think our growth in Him is small.  When I was 17 I told my mom I was done with church, that I saw no reason to go.  When I was 27 I felt God calling me back into the church.  And now, at 37, He's called me out of the church.  My growth in Him has been nothing short of miraculous, yet I still have such a long way to go.

Apparently, this process of circumcising the flesh can't happen overnight.  I mean it could, if God chose it to be that way, but I guess He has His reasons for taking His time. 

--------------------------
This seems awkward to me. If we desire to walk in the Spirit, desire transformation and want to be overcomers but we are not chosen to be - then are we spinning our wheels going nowhere?  Is our Father like that ?

I picture a child coming up to His dad and asking him to show him how to play ball. And his dad is a great ball player and coach. And the kid really wants to learn and the dad says no. I know you want to learn about baseball and play and I can teach you and show you but I don't want to. But I will teach your brother instead.

I know my illustration is a bit cold so don't jump all over me  ( smile). But this chosen thing needs to be explained to me. There are many believers who struggle and want to overcome the flesh and be transformed. But to say that maybe it is not chosen for them to be strikes me a little cold. I am just being honest.

[carol70]

But is this the case for example with God using my wife to tell me where I have gone astray? Doesn't God speaks through people  right? Then even when someone says something or points something out, I still repeat and walk like I am blind. It is like a child. Sometimes you have to tell them "no" or "don't " quite a few times until they get it.

God uses all sorts of methods to speak to us.  But revealing a blind spot and being purified and circumcised of the blind spot are completely different things.  We have to be brought to repentance first.  And we can't by our own strength remove our own sin - God has to do it for us.  It's like finding out you have cancer.  You can find out it's there, but someone else has to cut or burn it out of you.  At least that's the way I see it.

1 John 1

9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

[ciy]

Mrsnacks
Not to worry, if you want to be one of the elect then you are one of the elect if you are faithful to the end.  Just like Caleb and Joshua who did not want to go back to Egypt (the false doctrines taught in churches) but wanted to stay faithful to the end.  There are so many examples throughout the bible, but the one of the strongest to me is Phillippians 3:11-15

11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.

13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,

14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.

I believe if you want to be chosen you are "apprehended" and should press on for that mark set before you (faithful to the end) and not be like Judas who was called and chosen but was not faithful.
Just believe and press on.
CIY

[Kat]

Hi mrsnacks,

What I understand is that this present age is was never God's intention to bring the vast majority of mankind into the knowledge of the truth.  Everything that is happening, every single interaction we have, is part of God's plan/purpose to develop all of the unique people we have in the world.  So the whole world, that incliudes all of Christianity go about there lives exactly according to the purpose of God, but are blind to the truth.  This age is for mankind to learn by having an experience of good and evil.  The exception to this is the few God has specially chosen to prepare for a certain purpose.
When God begins to open the eyes of one of His chosen, I believe He works through everything in our lives to transform us exactly as He wants us, and at the pace He chooses. 
This is part of the Lake of Fire article on free will part c.  This article goes a lot into the experience that mankind is having now.

http://bible-truths.com/lake15-C.html --------------------------------

THE PURPOSE FOR WHICH GOD CREATED EVIL

This is all the strange work of God. There is no free will about it. We are all born out of a dark womb into the natural light of day, but this too is but a parable. We must be "born again" out of spiritual darkness of this age into the glorious light of the Sun of God. It is a painful journey, and requires an experience of evil to accomplish.

"It is an experience of evil Elohim [God] has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it" (Concorant Old Testament).

Now we can easily understand what is being said in this verse.

This "experience of evil" is not the purpose or goal of human existence, but this is indeed the process by which God is bringing His Sons and Daughters into glory! Most translations have hidden the meaning of this verse of Scripture. The translations just couldn't believe that God would do such a thing. They see it all around them. They see it in thousands of Scriptures, but they just couldn't bring themselves to come right out and say it, as God obviously has stated in the original Hebrew of this verse.

"It is an EXPERIENCE of EVIL that God has given to the sons of humanity to HUMBLE them by it."

And to this agrees the rest of Scripture:

"For ALL his days are SORROWS, and his travail [experience] GRIEF..."  (Ecc. 2:23).

The destiny of the human race is indeed GLORIOUS, but the journey is filled with evil and sorrow. This not to say that there are not many beautiful and good things in life, but for most the misery far far outweighs the pleasurable.

Do not be deceived: when Jesus said—"...I am come that they might have life and that they might have it more abundantly" (John 10:10), He was surely not speaking about this life, now, in the flesh! Contrary to the evil teachings of prosperity ministers, Jesus never promised us LARGER HOMES AND GREATER MATERIAL POSSESSIONS after we start following in His steps.

Jesus said that if we leave our parents, families, houses and possessions for His sake that we would receive a hundred fold of parents, families, houses and possessions NOW. But He was not speaking of receiving back NOW, these same PHYSICAL parents, families, and possessions, but rather the families and possessions we would receive NOW would be SPIRITUAL.

Does anyone really believe that if we leave our PHYSICAL PARENTS that He will give us another, different set of PHYSICAL PARENTS?   Well, yes, I guess there are those who are so spiritually ignorant that they might really believe that they will receive a brand new set of BIRTHING PARENTS to take the place of the ones they left.  However, the truth is: "...the words that I speak unto you, they are SPIRIT..." (John 6:63).

God created man in a "marred" condition, but God's plan has no mars whatsoever. It was not wrong or a sin for God to create mankind in a "marred" condition.  It was a perfect plan. It is now and always will be a perfect plan.

God has always worked all things after the counsel of His Own will. His plan needs no midstream adjustments, corrections, or refinements. It cannot be improved upon. It cannot be added to or detracted from. IT IS PERFECT.  GOD IS PERFECT. ALL WILL TURN OUT PERFECT. WE ALL WILL BE PERFECT BECAUSE GOD WILL BE "ALL IN ALL"! I believe it. I hope you do too.

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mercy, peace, and love
Kat