Forum Blues

[hillsbororiver]

Joe I very much appreciate this post. It makes me very sad when people decide to leave it hurts worse when they just leave without saying good bye. I for one get very attached to the people on this forum. I love them dearly and I feel bad when time goes by and I haven't seen someone post for awhile. Everyone here is so dear to me. I will admit that some are easier to get along with than others, but we just have to learn to deal with each other's differences!

When we remember that the reason we came here was because we understand that there is no other place to fellowship with like believers. There have been many days when just a word from someone here lifted me up and held me in place. The prayers of everyone here are the prayers of faithful friends and brothers and sisters  each one is an wonderful gift to me. I love sharing with everyone on this forum and I have enjoyed getting to know some better through pm's and email and now even on facebook! This is a great family and a great place to fellowship and enjoy each other in the Lord!

Thanks again, Joe for sharing this!
Love,
Kathy

Hi Kathy,

Many times during my 4 years here I have wondered and speculated on why some stray away or abruptly quit without a word or let themselves become so frustrated that they decide to not participate. Until I felt the same way.

Yes, there have been a few times when I was ready to toss aside the fellowship I cherish because some of the things I felt were very important (knowledge wise) that did not appear to be very important or interesting to the membership. It has been a recent transformation so to speak that I have come to the humbling realization that I have a very long way to go and grow in patience, long suffering and wisdom, when I move forward one step on this path I am on I have a better vantage point as to how far I really have to go.   

My old man, the beast had managed to fit me with a new set of blinders without me even being conscious of it, this carnal ego can disguise itself quite convincingly as an angel of light.

With that being said it is understandable that there are times we can become disillusioned here, is there anywhere on this earth where we won't at some point become frustrated or disappointed? But that brings right back to that pesky patience thing, when I am ready to make some knee jerk decision I pray that gentle voice reminds me of this, more often than not it requires a swift kick in the butt! 

Anyway, it always gives me great joy when I see someone return after a hiatus and return with perhaps a deeper understanding of how truly valuable a place such as this is to help and assist in keeping us focused on the prize, the Prize which is our Lord (and His mercy).

Peace,

Joe   

[hillsbororiver]

Hello Joe,

I may not have been here that long [almost a year] but I too have noticed that a few members which I talked with before, haven't let any comments/posts in a long time. I just pray that God is there with them, wherever they are, guiding them along "the path of righteousness".

I think some people just have a problem discerning between sharing thoughts and ideas, and trying to "teach" people. I've left several posts of 'revelations' [in my view] and other truths that have become clear to me, and many of us leave posts with words of guidance and wisdom for others here, especially the "newbies". Some of these could be interpreted as "teaching", but in reality it's just us helping out each other, and sharing what we've learned in the Scriptures and through Ray's teachings, and expanding on them, the correct way, by following God's Guidelines, such as:

1. "rightly dividing the Word of God"--II Timothy 2:15

2. "but in a multitude of counselors there is safety"--Proverbs 11:14

etc...

From my experience here so far, I believe the moderators have done an EXCELLENT job in discerning whether someone is attempting to by "our teacher", or someone is simply sharing their thoughts, ideas. Furthermore, between the moderators and the rest of the members here [especially the 'veteran' ones], I believe this Forum does a SUPERB job at sticking to the Scriptures, rather than throwing out random opinions and getting into "futile debates".

But that's just from my experience here. Perhaps there used to be more issues in the past, but since I've been here, this Forum has truly been LIKE NO OTHER ON THE INTERNET!! 


- Daywalker. 

Hi Daywalker,

First off I want to thank you for your fellowship here, there have been many times when I have read what you wrote and nodded my head in the affirmative as I contemplated your thoughts and observations.

Yes I agree that the debates and infighting that would rear its ugly head from time to time have slowed down the past few months to a year, as a matter of fact this period has been one of the most peaceful in memory, for this I must thank the members for their patience and their obvious willingness to put aside the differences that will always come when a group of people are conversing about matters that are of great importance to them.

Perhaps more of us are consciously or even subconsciously praying the prayer of Solomon that pleased the Lord exceedingly! (1Kings 3:9-12)

Peace,

Joe

[gmik]

Hi all!  What a wonderful thread!  I am so blessed reading everyones' posts.  Thank you.

I used to post all the time and love all the cyber-family I have "met" thru this forum.  I don't post as much and as new ones come on it is OK for me to not feel I have to post.  I come on almost every day and try to keep up w what is going on.  I love the fellowship here.  But it never fails to amaze me, after all these years, when people post excerpts from Ray, that I realize why we are all here.  It is the truths that we learn from Ray. That is what bonds me to all of you.

The mods have been wonderful.  I, like Nelson and Joe, remember the old days.  trust us folks, the forum "rules and regulations" are to help us not hinder us. Pray for the moderators and for each other.  Lift Ray up.  Rejoice in what God has done and Will do.

Love,
gena

[prarrydog]

Speaking for myself only, I continue to read several times a day however I have not felt like posting for quite some time.  I didn't grow up in a religious family.  I have almost no background in religion.  About four years ago (32 at the time), I happened to see a seventh day adventist show on TV that really struck a cord with me.  The next Saturday I found myself sitting in a SDA church, quietly singing songs and praying.  It did not take me long to get fired up and I would literally spend every free moment (many times until 5 or 6 in the morning) reading and researching everything to do with God, the bible, SDA etc. etc.  I gained a huge amount of knowledge in a short period of time. Lots of knowledge (but as Joe said) no wisdom.

It was around this time that I discovered Ray's site and subsequently this forum.  Anyway, to make a short story long, I used to post my opinions,quote scriptures, discuss and offer advice to friends and family, pray with my kids and was proud to be enlightened, until one day I realized that I wasn't nearly as "enlightened" as I thought I was.  I suddenly became quite embarrassed (and remain so) about my whole phony christian life.  So here I sit, a closet believer, afraid to discuss or even offer an opinion on anything Godly (can't even pray with my kids anymore).  I am in a bit of a dark place right now, as I am sure many of you have been, but am sure that one day I will snap out of it.  I don't know if I have ever asked for prayer before (if I did it was fake) but I do ask in earnest right now. 

Anyway, I am not even sure why I decided to write this or if it even adds anything to this thread but I just felt like I needed to say this. 

Scott

[Roy Martin]

Scott, I am touched by your post, and say with confidence that I know why you decided to write what you did. Its the choice that God wanted you to make, and God wants us to pray for you. Its not at all complicated as you may think it is. God has you where He wants you. We are no different than you. You are where you are for us, and us for you, and God for all of us and them.
Scott, its when we get into that dark place as you say you are that God is working a wonderful work; about to  bring in some light into your life. God just brought me out of the closet. It may have been a different closet, but it was a closet non the less.
Sounds like God just let a little light into your closet, otherwise you wouldn't have made a post, and asked for prayer. I'm excited for you and will pray for you right now and give thanks to Father God that His will is being done in your life.

Peace
Roy

[hillsbororiver]

Thanks Joe, very well put.
I think we have to be careful not to take this forum for granted and to recognize what a privilege it is to have this place.  The truth is so precious and rare and to have a group of people of like mind to discuss these things with is a phenomenon.  I know that God has given us this place and will keep it going as long as He sees fit.  God willing this forum will be here until Jesus returns, but we don't know that it will.  So I just want to make the most of this place every day that I can  

mercy, peace and love
Kat

 

Hi Kat,

What you wrote is very true, we have an unique opportunity to learn, share, empathize and encourage each other here and I don't think I would get an argument when I say that your contributions, time and patience have played a large part in this. If you had only done the transcripts (which I truly appreciate every time I access them) your contribution would be tremendous, but dear Sister you bring so much more than the attributes of a determined taskmaster. It is obvious that what you do is a labor of love.

Thank you Kat!

Peace,

Joe 

[Kat]

Thanks dear brother 

mercy, peace andlove
Kat

[arion]

Anyway, to make a short story long, I used to post my opinions,quote scriptures, discuss and offer advice to friends and family, pray with my kids and was proud to be enlightened, until one day I realized that I wasn't nearly as "enlightened" as I thought I was. 

Man I can identify with that.  When I was in the babalonian system I fancied myself a teacher.  I had all the sects doctrines down (AOG) and could argue scripture and 'win' debates with the best of them.  But I didn't know as much as what I thought I did and Ray's teachings harmonized the scriptures and blew me out of the water.  It seemed at the time that so many scriptures were in contradiction to others...and I knew that couldn't be the case.  Being yet carnal (and still way to carnal btw) I couldn't perceive the spiritual.  I am more than satisfied now with pretty much keeping my mouth shut and learning the lessons God has for me to learn.  It's all in his timing anyway and what both a revelation and relief that really is in the long run.

[Marlene]

Scott, I agree with Roy. It is God who led you to ask for Prayer. I have not been in here too long. I know, I am far from knowing alot. But, I will pray for you. Compassion for others is where God has me at. I have compassion on the whole world. No, one has it all down. That, is what we are in here for is to uplift each other and know we all are carrying that cross. Some, of us can share carrying that cross and it just may help the others who is going through the same thing. Also, I just know I can come in here some days and someone in here can help me by just there post.  Great Brothers and Sisters in here.

As for not being able to pray. God, knows what is in your heart. When, I cannot find words. I figure that is God telling me you do not need words, I know your heart. That, always humbles me and lets me kinow he is in control of it all. Don't worry over words just let God do it.

In His Love,
Marlene

[hillsbororiver]

(Quotes from Nelson in black, me in blue)

Hi folks,

Hey there Nelson,

Blessings to you Joe and as a 'new veteran' I know exactly what you're saying. These things have happened in the past and I'm sure they will happen again in the future too.

We can be certain that strife and contention will rear its head again, it is all about how we deal with it.

Joe knows me quite well and he'll confirm what I say. I have been a member of BT for many years and there were problems some years ago and the forum switched to this new format. Shortly after that there were many divisions among members and too many posts were ending up as fruitless debates and outright arguments. There were personal attacks on Ray (even though everyone should know that he doesn't visit this forum), on the moderators, and I even had detractors caning my person too.

Yes indeed!  There was a whole lot a judgin' goin' on over here!

All that resulted was division and the body suffered as a result. It was very sad to see these things happening but I'd say that it was the very sickle that this site needed. Well, those 'others' went off and started their own forums etc. and BT carried on. I remained a member here but also visited those other forums. Having seen the damage that comes from 'debates', 'rebuttles' and 'teachings' I reduced my visits on forums to just reading a few posts but I did drop the odd post here and there. I spent time with the Lord, some time in the wilderness and some time with Joe (on a visit to Florida last year) and that worked well for me. I did most of my communicating privately through PM's and did not post very often in the forums.

You know Nelson it was also very good for me to have personal face time with you and the others I have been blessed to meet in person, being mutual "friends" of our Savior certainly does break down any artificial barriers. Each time the comfort level and joy of fellowship was every bit as satisfying as visiting with an old friend you haven't seen in a long time.

I have been to 5 Conferences and this feeling permeates throughout the entire weekend but with so many people and relatively so little time to spend with each individual it is an extra special blessing to meet with a Brother and or Sister in our own home (as we did) or even just meeting up for dinner or an event. But back to your point I look back to the period you speak of and I truly repent of the way I would feed the fire of adversity rather than at least make a patient, honest effort in understanding where others might be coming from. Perhaps they were unjustified and wrong but my attitude convicts me just as well. I was right, they were wrong, end of story. 

You my friend were a true peacemaker during this trial attempting to bridge divides as you reminded us of exactly why we were communicating with each other in the first place. This has been seared into my mind and I have drawn on this lesson often since that time.

I have no doubt that the reason you were "caned" was that you would not allow yourself to be drawn into an "us against them" position, I'll admit being a bit frustrated by that at the time but the wisdom displayed by seeking understanding is not lost on me now.     

The Lord has shown me many wonderful things, He brought me to BT where I learned much truth and gained valuable fellowship. The way to life is difficult and physical fellowship is very minimal and so this board is a beacon for God's elect. It is the fellowship and edifying found here that's like food for my soul, that's why I spend most of my time in this section of the forum. We have a oneness of the spirit that should be enjoyed and a love among ourselves that can be expressed through the internet as well as felt in our spirit.

Amen!

I can understand that some may feel burdened trying to read through and/or replying to posts on the forum, but if we've reached a point where that is so then we must take serious stock of what we are doing and more importantly, WHY we're doing it.

It is so easy to lose sight of the fact that any trials and/or tribulations no matter how severe or relatively minor are put into our paths to form us into Sons and Daughters of the Living God! The creator of all things has a personal interest in each and every one of us as individuals. It is too awesome to fully comprehend.

This place is our congregation, let's use it to edify and build up, to offer support & prayer to each other, to share what the Lord is showing us and to accept some reproof where needed (I certainly know the value of that), and this place will not be the house of blues, but the house of the rising Son (sorry couldn't resist that one) and then we can all bask in the warmth rather than shiver in the cold.

The Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit my brothers and sisters

House of the Rising Son!  Love it, great pun because it is so appropriate. Perhaps I should have titled this thread "Forum Jazz" since there are so many great individual variations on a theme being brought forth.

I love the blues though (as I do most every musical form), the music ironically named Blues to me is anything but blue, but is exceptionally uplifting, full of hope and survival through sometimes very trying times.   

Nelson

Thank you Nelson for another thoughtful post and especially for your friendship.

Peace,

Joe

[hillsbororiver]

Thank you Joe, and everyone else. Very edifying, beneficial and humbling to be reminded as to why we are all here. This is very encouraging, and uplifting spiritually. All the glory is His.

Peace & Love
G.Driggs

All the glory is His!

Amen George, so true Brother, so true.

Peace,

Joe

[hillsbororiver]

Gal 5:23  Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.


             

Thanks for sharing that great verse, Joe. That was the best part of your whole post. 

Hi Extol,

The scriptures are certainly the most germane essence of any post or thread, there is nothing quite like having a familiar verse or verses come to life with a new understanding. 

Peace,

Joe 

[Roy Coates]

Two thumbs up to all. Kat and Joe what a bonus you guys are. Forum family, what would I do with out you. God bless all of you with mercy, grace and peace. Roy

[judith collier]

To all who posted, what a wonderful thread. See what you started Roy! And it is good. There is another reason someone might drop out. I have a tendency to gather info and then get bored which is why I need teachers. I was never much for detail, never having had the patience for it. Also, when problems arise and I am overwhelmed I tend to QUIT GOD, hate to reach out and withdraw, that all or nothing attitude. Well, hot or cold if you like. Anyway, I do appreciate the moderators and everyone that comes on here and also miss them when it has been awhile.  Judy

[hillsbororiver]

I am determined to respond to everyone who took the time and effort to comment here, there have been quite a few things popping up that have restricted me from being able to do this in a timely manner but I do feel indebted to you all and even if this topic has become old news the desire to let you as individuals know my appreciation inspires me to continue......

Hi Marlene,

Thanks for your thoughtful post, I will respond in blue to the points that jumped out at me, you black, me blue;

I love all the post here. I agree so much with them. When, I first joined although I read for a year. I just could not get over my feelings for the people in Babylon. Ones, who I loved. But, I never understood Gods Good News or his plan for the whole world.

You have plenty of company Sister, most of us have had the same experience, I can't say I ever really bought into the hell doctrine but I was convinced of annihilation of those who would not "come to Jesus."

I have gone into one christian forum that teaches some of the things like Ray. That, lasted one day. It was total confusion every one talking there own mind and no scripture. I need the guidance with the scriptures. I make up a folder on scriptures you all have brought up in topics so I can remember them and help my bad memory from a stroke a year before coming in here. Now, I read in different versions to help my understanding.

This has been my experience as well in regard to visiting other UR Forums, a whole lot of feelings coupled with liberal interpretations of a single verse, I hold no animosity toward them but the experience was less than edifying (for me) as the debates prospered and thoughtful consideration suffered. All too often it was mini wars within the topics as folks shouted over each other ignoring some responses as they zeroed in on their "adversary" with laser precision. To me this (now) is both tedious and exhausting. There was a time though that I was guilty of doing the very same thing right here!

When, I first came in here I felt like a fish out of water. I felt misunderstood. Some, of the scriptures I was still seeing with blind eyes. You could have beat me up with them and I would not have understood. I thought, I was doing more harm then good by being in here. But, then God gave the desire to keep on learning and being patient with him and he would teach me and give me understanding.

Amen!

I am happy you were not driven away and that you persevered. Obviously the Spirit of our Lord directed and inspired you to test the spirits and trust in Him that your time spent here would bear fruit in your spiritual journey.

But, I love all of you. Someone often post about something I am going through that day or during the week. I love all the ones who can show me scriptures and then God opens my eyes. Just, a thought you might give on the scriptures. I know, I am a long ways off then many of you. But, now I know I am right where God wants me to be. I don't care about my bad memory. I don't care about my days of physical pain. I am just eager to learn what ever the good Lord lets me. I thank him every day and night for all of you. God has always enabled me to be a fighter when I was very ill working. I did my job as if God was standing there watching me. He was my boss. When, I became to ill to work, every bit of time I can I come in here and read my Bible all the time.

Isn't it incredible that so often a topic or even a post within a thread will absolutely nail something we have been contemplating, providing scriptures to meditate on and even giving us positive reinforcement that the experiences or thoughts we are having are also being felt by others? It is encouraging to know we are not losing our minds, or that even if we are at least we have company! 

I cannot get enough of God period. That,s why I made copies of Ray's papers so I could read if I am laying down. My sleeping patterns are strange because of pain. But, I can talk to God or I can read . Or he gives me rest. Or he helps the pain. I know, God has made me a fighter.

Now this is something that amazes me constantly, I just cannot stop thinking about this stuff, morning, noon, evening, night, in my dreams/sleep, there is no escape, this is not of me or the result of some conscious decision of mine, that is for sure.     

I always ask God to kick me in the rump if this becomes about me.

And He certainly will.  We should all really take comfort in this.

Heb 12:8  But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye ********, and not sons (or daughters).

If, I am so sensitive and can't get over myself.  I was senstive at first when I came in here. But, God got me over that.  I know, of others who have left. I see there names in black. I pray for them. Then, I think what may have happened that they left. I have some I love who have pm me. They left and I do not know why. Could be for various reasons. But, I pray often for them. I think they might have passed away. Or, having money problems. I just pray and wait to see if God helps them to return.

It is always a joyful experience when they return, but there are so many reasons anyone might decide to leave or even feel compelled to leave, we should be comforted in the fact that being a member here is not a prerequisite for salvation! 

God has them right where He wants them, whether we (or they) like it or not. This earthly journey was not designed to be about what we want, it is about recognizing God's wisdom in all things and being faithful through bitter and sweet times.

Well, I did not plan on making a book about this. But, like Joe, after reading others who believe some like Ray  they differ on many things. When , you read even some of there books you find they are not always matching up with scriptures. God has lead Ray with his Spirit. It is the only thing I found that goes into the deep things of Christ. It truely is Bible truths. It never ceases to amaze me when God increases my understanding. What, really amazes me is when I see him helping me to live it not just know it.

This dear Sister is the truly important matter, unless we are striving to live it we really are nothing more than (as Ray says) "religious hobbyists."

I hope we never loose this and I thank God for Ray and all of you. But, I also know if it should happen we will be ok cause God is in it all . This is a gift from God and I thank him. Yes, like Ray's said, that he is just a human. So, we all are. But, you are my Brothers and Sisters in Christ and I take this serious.

Beautiful post Marlene, thank you.

In His Love,
Marlene

Peace,

Joe

[G. Driggs]

It is always a joyful experience when they return, but there are so many reasons anyone might decide to leave or even feel compelled to leave, we should be comforted in the fact that being a member here is not a prerequisite for salvation! 

Great post Joe, I really needed to hear this for some reason.

Peace,Love G.Driggs

[hillsbororiver]

Great post Marlene, we cant go wrong if we keep focused on Him always.

Pro 3:6 In all thy ways, acknowledge him, and, he, will make straight thy paths. (Rotherham)

Pro 4:18  The path of those who do what is right is like the first gleam of dawn. It shines brighter and brighter until the full light of day (NIrV)

Act 2:25  For David says this about him: 'I saw Adonai always before me, for he is at my right hand, so that I will not be shaken.
Act 2:26  For this reason, my heart was glad; and my tongue rejoiced; and now my body too will live on in the certain hope
Act 2:27  that you will not abandon me to Sh'ol or let your Holy One see decay.
Act 2:28  You have made known to me the ways of life; you will fill me with joy by your presence.' (CJB)

Peace & Love
G.Driggs

Hi George, you know if I keep up at this pace I just might finish responding to everyone by the time the Mobile 2009 Bible Conference begins....

The reason this is so important to me is that there have been times when I took this place for granted and was complacent and cavalier about an opportunity relatively few believers have been blessed with. Yes, ultimately this journey is a One on one walk with our Lord but since we are still flesh and blood and living in (but not of) this world words of encouragement and empathy can be just the spiritual tonic any of us might need today and all of us need from time to time.

The following two verses you provided especially jumped out at me;

Pro 3:6 In all thy ways, acknowledge him, and, he, will make straight thy paths. (Rotherham)

Pro 4:18  The path of those who do what is right is like the first gleam of dawn. It shines brighter and brighter until the full light of day (NIrV)

I used to think and we know there are many in (and out) of the churches that believe making "straight thy paths" (notice the plural?) means making our lives comfortable in the here and now, luxuries and a peaceful relatively pain free existence awaits us if only we acknowledge Him. For me this straightening of my own path (which of course is unique to me as your path is unique to you) means that the objective of God and His plan and purpose for us collectively and as individuals has become clearer in our understanding, not that it becomes a cakewalk but that we know the trials and tribulations of this life is the necessary knowledge of good and evil that we must know and experience to claim our full inheritance!

This experience "shines brighter and brighter" not because of all the shiny, glittering earthly successes we might receive but rather like what Paul wrote;

Rom 5:3  And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;

2Co 12:9  And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

Peace,

Joe

[hillsbororiver]

Thank you for the wonderful message Joe, which is warming my heart.
Bluzman

You are welcome Brother, all the responses and additions have warmed my heart as well, I truly value all of you.

Peace,

Joe

[hillsbororiver]

George in black, Joe in blue....

Thanks Joe,

No, thank YOU George!

When i grow up i want to be able to write just like you.

Ha! The feeling is mutual Brother, you have given me so many opportunities to meditate on the profound truths of His Word in your posts.

I know that takes time and study and eating humble pie often. That humble pie i have learned to like the taste of, much better than pumpkin pie, which i do not like.

MMMMMM humble pie...... a little salt, baked by a Consuming Fire, and the ultimate result is perfection! 

(By the way I like pumpkin pie) 

There is not part of your post, that i would not heartily endorse. Thanks for saying for me, what i cannot yet express as eloquently as you just did.

You do more than you realize.

It is a painful experience whenever someone gets offended or tired and leave without even a so long or goodbye. There really are so few people, in this Country of over 300 million population, that one can discuss the more profound Truths Of GOD'S Scripture.

Amen!

I think that is enough from me, except to add, all my BT sisthren and brethren are today, the only ones that i can even discuss The Scriptures with. That is without being regarded as a three headed monster, who hates GOD, and despises the Sacrifice Of Jesus Christ.

From one three headed monster to another; I agree 100%

LORD; how much longer,

This is my prayer as well.....

george.

Peace,

Joe

[bunnylife]

BT, Ray and his teachings and my brothers and sisters in Christ - all of this is truly a precious gift from Daddy God. I have not been here long at all but this is a place where you can get the word of God in truth and love. You can drink of the living waters that refreshes your souls and renew your minds that brings about change; transformation from glory to glory to becoming sons and daughters of the Most High God in Daddy God's timing.

The journey of the heart is the less traveled road. Not many dare to go down these paths. There are hardships, heartbreaks, sickness, financial problems, losing family and friends over truth.. high cliffs, dry deserts, low valleys, dark caves, danger around corners... why do we go? Daddy God has chosen us to do and to will for His good pleasure. In His good pleasure is sweetest of fruit love, joy, peace, patience, goodness, kindness, gentleness, faithfulness and self control. The joy is unspeakable, peace that surpasses all understanding and love depths and heights that can not be measured. We are the living stones the body of Christ being fitted (assembled) together for such an awesome purpose. It is all of God. Glory be to His Name.

It is Daddy God that brought me here to fellowship with you with like minds and share and carrying one another burdens and to love all.  You are my family. Each one of you God's unique masterpiece in progress. You are blessed and you all are a blessing to me. 

In His Joy,
Bunni