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kill the body and destroy the soul??
darren:
There's a scripture that goes (now this is not a direct quote) but it goes something like this. Fear Him that can kill the body and destroy the soul. Sorry if I mangled this scripture. I thought the word soul is just another word for person or body. Does anyone have any feelings on this subject??
Darren
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: darren on August 16, 2009, 09:26:57 PM ---There's a scripture that goes (now this is not a direct quote) but it goes something like this. Fear Him that can kill the body and destroy the soul. Sorry if I mangled this scripture. I thought the word soul is just another word for person or body. Does anyone have any feelings on this subject??
Darren
--- End quote ---
Excerpt from Lake of Fire series #16-D3 (http://bible-truths.com/lake16-D3.htm):
MAYBE THE MOST ENIGMATIC SCRIPTURE IN ALL THE BIBLE
Jesus told His disciples in this sermon that if they called a brother "fool" they would be in danger of "Gehenna fire." What kind of danger is that. How does this Gehenna fire actually judge us. Is there anywhere that we are told how Gehenna judges us to make us "righteous?" There is a verse that specifically addresses what Gehenna accomplishes, but it is one of the least understood verses in all Scripture:
"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell [Gehenna fire]" (Matt. 10:28).
The biggest problem in understanding this verse, is to understand who this verse is talking about. The Church will tell you that it is talking about those who will suffer loss of salvation in the eternal fires of hell. Yet nothing could be further from the truth. This verse was addressed directly to and about the 12 apostles, and is applied to all Christ's disciples throughout all generations.
Go back to the first verse of chapter 10 for the contextual proof that Jesus is instructing his Apostles only in this teaching: "These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them [no one else, just 'them,' just the twelve apostles], saying..." And Jesus continues speaking unbroken all the way to the eleventh chapter, to His twelve apostles only.
If it is the world of unrepentant sinners that are to "fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell," then why oh why didn't Jesus make this clear to His apostles in these verses? But no, Jesus warned His apostles that they are to be the ones fearing. Notice:
"...He called unto Himself His twelve disciples... These twelve Jesus sent forth and commanded them saying... [Jesus continues speaking to His apostles only] ...And fear not them [their enemies and persecutors] which kill the body [their body; your body], but are not able to kill the soul [your soul]: but rather fear Him [you twelve apostles] which is able to destroy both soul and body [both YOUR soul and YOUR body] in hell [Gehenna fire]" (Matt. 10:1, 5, & 28).
Assuredly, Jesus was not warning the wicked to not fear the wicked who, when they kill the wicked cannot kill the soul... No, this instruction is for believers.
Gehenna is judgment. It is not torture in literal fire. It is judgment upon God's Elect to spiritually purify them; to make them holy and blameless; and to make them strong. Gehenna speaks of judgment, and Jesus taught that God is "able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna." How are we (God's Elect) presently being destroyed in both body and soul? Notice what Jesus said a few verses after He made this statement:
"He that finds his life [Gk: 'psuche' - soul, not zoe which is life] shall lose it: and he that loses his life [soul] for My sake shall find it" (Matt. 10:39).
We must be spiritually baptized into Christ's death, and we must also LOSE OUR SOUL for Christ's sake.
Learn to read Scriptures accurately and precisely. Take note that Jesus did NOT say "And fear not them which KILL the body, but are not able to KILL the soul, but rather fear Him which is able to KILL both soul and body in hell [Gk: Gehenna]." No, Jesus did NOT say that, but it is assumed that He either said that or at least meant that. No, He did not. Jesus said: "And fear not them which KILL the body, but are not able to KILL the soul, but rather fear Him which is able to DESTROY both soul and body in hell [Gk: Gehenna]."
Why the switch? Jesus switches from "kill" to "destroy."
It is our "soul" that God is more interested in than our "life." An insane person may have a perfectly healthy life, but his soul is severely damaged. A comatose person may be in perfect physical health and be very much "alive," but possesses virtually no soul-conscious awareness, character, love, emotions, knowledge, hopes and dreams, memories, etc.
Now then, "destroy" in verse 28 is the Greek word 'appolumi' and it means: DESTROY, PARISH, LOSE. Wow! Are you seeing this? How much easier my job would be if only the translators had been consistent, but God didn't want them to be consistent. It's all part of the worldwide deception which is a necessary part of God's plan. In verse 18 Jesus says that God can "appolumi your body and soul." In verse 39 Jesus tells us that we must "appolumi our own soul." Either we 'appolumi' -destroy/lose our souls, or God will 'appolumi' our souls for us, and that is not the way we want to go, seeing that: "It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the Living God" (Heb. 10:31).
And notice this is precisely what we read in Matt. 5:29- "If your right eye offend you [then YOU] pluck it out... And if your right hand offend you [then YOU] cut it off... and not that your whole body should be cast [by GOD, 'fear HIM'] into Gehenna" (Matt. 5:28-30).
We must pluck out and cut off those members of the body which are used to sin against God:
"Mortify therefore your members [Gk: 'melos' -'parts of the BODY' -Dr. Strong] which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: For which things' sake the wrath of God comes ['fear HIM'] on the children of disobedience: In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them. But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth. Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds; And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the Image of Him that created him [it]" (Col. 3:5-10).
But hopefully by now, we all know that the different "members" of our body [pluck out your eye; cut off your hand; cut off your foot] do not actually sin, but it is the heart and carnal mind of man that uses the members of his body to commit sin: "Neither yield you your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin..." (Rom. 6:13).
So then God teaches us to "fear HIM" and in so doing, destroy [Gk: 'apollumi' -destroy, perish, lose] our soul by "plucking out and cutting off" these members of our body so as to stop using them as "instruments of unrighteousness unto sin" so that God will not have to "destroy both our body and our soul in Gehenna" by "CASTING us into Gehenna." Are you beginning to understand the judgment of "Gehenna fire" and how it works?
Hope this helps,
Marques
jerreye:
What a powerful letter that was from Ray! Couldn't get any clearer. I can't wait until my eyes and hands and feet and every other member of my carnal self is plucked out and cut off. May God give us the strength to do just that!
MePogo:
So then God teaches us to "fear HIM" and in so doing, destroy [Gk: 'apollumi' -destroy, perish, lose] our soul by "plucking out and cutting off" these members of our body so as to stop using them as "instruments of unrighteousness unto sin" so that God will not have to "destroy both our body and our soul in Gehenna" by "CASTING us into Gehenna." Are you beginning to understand the judgment of "Gehenna fire" and how it works? [/color]
Hope this helps,
Marques
[/quote]
I still have trouble with the "fear HIM" thing because I can't equate love and fear and I do believe God is Love. I can't love what I fear. What I don't love is that part of my being capable of offending God; that which is sin. Someone told me some time ago that when I see the word fear, replace it with awe. It works for me and, with my incomplete knowledge and understanding, I can love God and detest the part of me (flesh) that offends Him. I might have this all wrong, but I think of the fire as the ultimate cleanser.... and the flesh and the sin is gone, thrown into the fire. What comes back is a purified soul, more worthy of the love that He gave me (us all). I might have this all wrong, and won't be offended if I am corrected, but the words that sin and death are thrown into the fire are the words that brought clarity to the whole "hell" issue. If the fire consumes death and sin, then they are no more....not our spirit, which was cleansed by the sacrifice of Christ who made our rebirth in the spirit possible.
If I haven't got this right, please correct me.
;)
Love and blessings to all,
Pogo
aqrinc:
Hi Pogo,
Many times in The OT the word fear is used instead of a more appropiate word. Fear GOD is use over 300 times in The KJV; the majority should be other words like Revere, Reverence, Honor, Worship, Awe or other such expressions of Wonder and Love.
But there are also quite a few times when Fear is the appropiate word; see the thread below for some examples of different uses matching different Bible translations. This is not by any stretch authorative, but my effort to find Scripture that witnesses to many different uses of those words.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,10234.0.html
Fear is a Good thing sometimes, as it makes us stop and count the cost before going ahead with some harebrained scheme or even something we think is worthwhile but may cause hurt or damage to others and ourselves.
george. :)
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