> General Discussions
Is water baptism necessary
cjwood:
'diving in the deep end', by reading the list of emails to ray, where navigating has been made available and easy by our kat, is the perfect spot to jump into the water, where you then can come to see there are even 'deeper waters' to navigate into (ray's specific teachings). by continuing to dive deeper into the Scriptures, the Waters of Living Truth become evident.
claudia
darren:
Greetings Ron: the only advice I can offer you is take your time. Give your brain a chance to absorb Ray's writings, they are an eye opener. Go slow, it will be well worth it.
Darren
PS Great post Claudia
elias3013:
Thanks all for the greeting and references.
I'll read a lot and be back.
Ron
soberxp:
yes,Jesus was baptized by John.
Matthew 3:
14 But John tried to deter him, saying, "I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?"
15 Jesus replied, "Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness." Then John consented.
Marky Mark:
--- Quote from: soberxp on December 25, 2009, 01:18:22 PM ---yes,Jesus was baptized by John.
Matthew 3:
14 But John tried to deter him, saying, "I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?"
15 Jesus replied, "Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness." Then John consented.
--- End quote ---
soberxp,hello.
If you are saying that we all need to be baptized by water that is a false assumption.We as true followers of Christ need to be baptized of the Spirit,not of the flesh.
GW
John 1:25 They asked John, "Why do you baptize if you're not the Messiah or Elijah or the prophet?"
John 1:26 John answered them, "I baptize with water. Someone you don't know is standing among you.
John 1:27 He's the one who comes after me. I am not worthy to untie his sandal strap."
John 1:28 This happened in Bethany on the east side of the Jordan River, where John was baptizing.
John 1:29 John saw Jesus coming toward him the next day and said, "Look! This is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.
John 1:30 He is the one I spoke about when I said, 'A man who comes after me was before me because he existed before I did.'
John 1:31 I didn't know who he was. However, I came to baptize with water to show him to the people of Israel."
John 1:32 John said, "I saw the Spirit come down as a dove from heaven and stay on him.
John 1:33 I didn't know who he was. But God, who sent me to baptize with water, had told me, 'When you see the Spirit come down and stay on someone, you'll know that person is the one who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.'
John 1:34 I have seen this and have declared that this is the Son of God.
Here is an email reply on baptism from Ray. Hope this helps.
http://bible-truths.com/email3.htm#baptism
--- Quote ---I want to know what you know or teach on water baptism? I have been going through some of the articles that The Divine Plan has.
I am a former World Wide Church Of God member that has been really mixed up with different teachings. Everybody has different teachings.
So far you seem to have what I Think is a closer teaching what the Word of GOD is saying... Your articles have very helpful to me.
THANKS.
P.S. I'll be keeping in touch
[Ray Replies]
Thank you for your email and question.
I don't have the time to write an whole article on the subject in an email. One day I will do that and post it on my site. But in a nut shell:
Paul tells us that we no longer know Jesus AFTER the flesh. Jesus Christ came IN THE FLESH to lead us INTO THE SPIRIT. It was paramount to be CIRCUMCISED, KEEP HOLY DAYS, KEEP SABBATH, PAY TITHES, and many PHYSICAL THINGS under the law of Moses.
Jesus came with binding laws of the spirit. In Matt. 5, 6, and 7 Jesus said
"you have heard it said [by the LAW OF MOSES]..." that you are to do this or do that, but Jesus said, "BUT I SAY UNTO YOU..."
And then He gave a different and contradicting law.
Examples:
"Swear" under Moses / DON'T SWEAR AT ALL UNDER CHRIST.
"Hate your enemies" under Moses / LOVE YOUR ENEMIES UNDER CHRIST!
"Don't commit adultery" under Moses / DON'T EVEN LOOK TO LUST AFTER A WOMAN UNDER CHRIST!
Get the point?
God said he would write His NEW COVENANT (not a revised version of the OLD COVENANT) upon the minds and hearts of His followers.
Circumcision was so very important to every Jewish man. Paul said "Circumcision IS NOTHING"!!!
So drastic was this change brought about by Jesus Christ, that Paul said that a PHYSICAL JEW of the PHYSICAL NATION OF ISRAEL, who is PHYSICALLY CIRCUMCISION in the flesh only, IS NO JEW AT ALL!!! But a GENTILE, not of the nation of Israel, and NOT PHYSICALLY CIRCUMCISED in the flesh, but CIRCUMCISED IN HIS HEART, HE, A GENTILE, IS A JEW!!! (Rom. 2:27-29).
Now then, with that in mind turn to Col.2:19-13:
"And ye are COMPLETE IN HIM, which is the head of all principality and power: In Whom also ye ARE CIRCUMCISED [how?] with the circumcision MADE WITHOUT HANDS, in putting off the body of the SINS OF THE FLESH by the CIRCUMCISION OF CHRIST: buried with Him in BAPTISM [how? same way! "without hands" or water], wherein also ye ARE RISEN WITH HIM through the faith of the operation of God, Who has raised Him from the dead. And you, being DEAD IN YOUR SINS and the uncircumcision of your flesh, has he quickened [made alive] together with Him, having FORGIVEN YOU ALL TRESPASSES."
According to Paul, "How many baptisms are there?"
"There is ONE body, and ONE Spirit, even as ye are called in ONE hope of your calling; ONE Lord, ONE faith, ONE BAPTISM, ONE God and Father of all, Who is above all, and through all, and in you all" (Eph. 4:4-6).
Water baptism avails us NOTHING unless we are BAPTIZED INTO CHRIST (Rom. 6:3-7) with a baptism WITHOUT HANDS--not of the letter and the flesh, but of the SPIRIT!
Nothing that we do that starts in the flesh can add one cubic to our spiritual stature.
Hope that helps your understanding a little better.
God be with you,
Ray
--- End quote ---
Peace...Mark
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