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bIBLICAL VERIFICATION: re: animals

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Duane:
In careful re-reading of "Exposing Those Who Contradict" (on printed page 96) Ecc. 3: 16-21 says:  "For that which befalls the sons of men befalls beasts ,(pets?)...as one dies, so does the other; yea, they ALL have one SPIRIT and man  has NO preeminence above the beasts (in death) for all is vanity.  ALL go to one place; all are of the dust,  and all return to dust again."

Our bodies and souls are in the grave until the resurrection but our SPIRITS are returned to God at death.  God owns and creates ALL living things.  Man has NO preminence over beasts-- as ALL SPIRITS return to God
at death.  (I am fully aware that Jesus didn't die for the "sins" of animals in preparation for Heaven.)

However, Ray writes "Beasts (animals) don't go to heaven or hell when they die."  (No Bible verse, as Ray usually writes after EACH declarative statement.) 

If all SPIRITS return to God at death, and heaven is not a PHYSICAL PLACE but rather a mental state prepared
 by God, what is the harm or hurt in enjoying your favorite pet(s) in heaven?

Dennis Vogel:

--- Quote ---what is the harm or hurt in enjoying your favorite pet(s) in heaven?
--- End quote ---

Depends. Why do you enjoy your pet now? Is it because they are loyal and love you with no regard to your faults? Will you still have that desire (need) to be loved unconditionally (vanity?) in the next life?

A loyal dog almost worships it's owner. It gets all excited and dances around when it simply sees it owner. Would that be acceptable in the next life?

Perhaps God does have a place for our pets in the next life. I don't know.

Linny:
I have pondered this myself but I do not see anything in that particular Scripture that answers the question.  It appears to me to be saying we all die, dust to dust, not that we all return to God.
The translations of vs. 21 are very different so I would like to study that one further.

At this point, unless someone can prove it to me by Scripture, I feel that we are the only creation that returns to God at the resurrection.

Duane:
Dennis....THANK YOU for your honest "I don't know"! 
This FORUM just boosted it's credability with me 1000% with that honest answer--where OTHER
pastor, teacher, sages would have resorted to some "cock and bull" just to HAVE AN ANSWER!
(Honesty goes a loooong way!)

HOWEVER, Ray made a declarative statement where he FLAT OUT stated "that animals would neither go to heaven or hell".  That is NOT like Ray to omit a scripture after a statement meant as fact.  Would YOU please ask him for us-- as you have a special connection with him, having founded the FORUM.  ALSO, let him KNOW that we pray for his health daily!  Duane & Betty

judith collier:
I thought man had preeminence over beasts because of our God given dominion over them.
I think there are many, many things we do not know.

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