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Author Topic: confused  (Read 2370 times)

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santikos

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confused
« on: November 24, 2010, 01:29:50 PM »

Rev 19:16  On His vesture and on His thigh He has a name written, King of kings and Lord of lords.

You know who the King is, thatís Christ.  Who are the kings?  The kings are the heavens.  We are the heavens.  Here is a portion of Godís kingdom made up of heavens.  Godís Spirit is dwelling in you  - God dwells in heaven, but in plural, heavens.  God dwells in the heavens of His kingdom.  We are the heavens of His kingdom.
 
ďKing of kings, Lord of lords.Ē  Who is Lord?  Jesus Christ.  Who are the lords, plural?  We are the lords.
 
     
I was listening to the "Gospel of the kindgom" teaching, and i like the way ray just kept me on my toes as to wondering what is the gospel. but when he said we are the heavens i was flabergasted. Now i know that heaven is not this place of bliss for eternity, but i was just not sure how to understand that we are the heavens. He also said that jesus was in heaven and will come back. but if we are the heavens how is he coming back if he is now with us? I do believe that we are the heavens but i dont just want to believe it because ray teaches it. I just need some more explanation. Thanks in advance for your assistance. I will listen to the sermon again, and try to understand the spiritual aspect to the matter.
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mharrell08

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Re: confused
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2010, 03:15:32 PM »

Rev 19:16  On His vesture and on His thigh He has a name written, King of kings and Lord of lords.

You know who the King is, thatís Christ.  Who are the kings?  The kings are the heavens.  We are the heavens.  Here is a portion of Godís kingdom made up of heavens.  Godís Spirit is dwelling in you  - God dwells in heaven, but in plural, heavens.  God dwells in the heavens of His kingdom.  We are the heavens of His kingdom.
 
ďKing of kings, Lord of lords.Ē  Who is Lord?  Jesus Christ.  Who are the lords, plural?  We are the lords.
 
     
I was listening to the "Gospel of the kindgom" teaching, and i like the way ray just kept me on my toes as to wondering what is the gospel. but when he said we are the heavens i was flabergasted. Now i know that heaven is not this place of bliss for eternity, but i was just not sure how to understand that we are the heavens.

Here's another excerpt from the same transcript (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6142.msg49588.html#msg49588):

So what is the kingdom?   We are the kingdom of God.  We are the kingdom of the heavens. 
Where does God reside?  In heaven.  God resides in heaven, but it is not called the kingdom of heaven in the Greek, you can check Rotherham and all those, itís kingdom of the heavens, plural.  We are the temple of God.  God resides in His temple God resides in heaven.  We are the heaven in which God resides, where He dwells.
But donít get to haughty, because the Scriptures say, not even all the heaven of the heavens can contain Him.

2Chron 6:18  ÖBehold, heaven and the heaven of heavens cannot contain You.  How much less this temple which I have built!

But never the less it is true, He does dwell in the heavens.  But they canít even contain Him, Heís bigger than that.  But He does dwell in His heavens, we are His heavens, we are His spiritual kingdom.
  But it does not yet appear what we shall be, we only have the earnest, down payment of His spirit.

Eph 1:14  which is an earnest of our inheritance, unto the redemption of God's own possession, unto the praise of his glory.


God dwells in the heavens is another way of saying God dwells in us. The same way God dwells in His spiritual temple means He dwells in us as we are the temple of God [1 Cor 3:16].


He also said that jesus was in heaven and will come back. but if we are the heavens how is he coming back if he is now with us? I do believe that we are the heavens but i dont just want to believe it because ray teaches it. I just need some more explanation. Thanks in advance for your assistance. I will listen to the sermon again, and try to understand the spiritual aspect to the matter.

All things consist by Jesus [Col 1:17], everything is held together by Him. Even a heathen would cease to exist without Jesus.

But Jesus talked about a special relationship with His apostles/disciples:

John 14:15-28  If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.


Jesus abides or dwells in us when we obey Him. That is how He returns to us. That is what is meant in Revelation of Christ 'coming quickly'. He comes quickly to those who obey His Word.


Hope this helps,

Marques
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aqrinc

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Re: confused
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2010, 03:22:24 PM »

Hi Santikos,

Try the Scripture below for confirmation. There are many other such verses that will help you to see.


(ASV).

1Co 3:16  Know ye not that ye are a temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

1Co 6:19  Or know ye not that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit which is in you, which ye have from God? and ye are not your own;
1Co 6:20  for ye were bought with a price: glorify God therefore in your body.
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Marky Mark

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Re: confused
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2010, 04:28:19 PM »

Believe the Word.

 Luk 17:20  And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21  Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Eph 2:6  And raised us up together, and seated us together in the heavenlies, in Christ:

Php 3:20  For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:


KingdomG932
βασιλεία
basileia
bas-il-i'-ah
From G935; properly royalty, that is, (abstractly) rule, or (concretely) a realm (literally or figuratively): - kingdom, + reign.

Without the Lord causing you to understand the things of the Spirit, one will never be able to understand things which can not be seen[invisible].Pray to God and ask Him to show you what you ask of and then continue to have Faith in the things of God.The more time you spend in Scripture the more God will show you what you seek,if it is His Will to do so.

2Ti 2:15  Give diligence, thyself, approved, to present unto God,óa workman not to be put to shame, skillfully handling the word of truth.

Email response from Ray.

Dear Beth:
        The "Kingdom of God" also known as the "Kingdom of the heavenS," is God'd domain, where He resides.  To the degree that we have God's Spirit is the degree to which we reside in this Kingdom. At present we are merely begotten, awaiting a new birth into His Kingdom. This Kingdom has no end after the physical has passed away. Etc.  Too big a subject for an email.
        God be with you,
        Ray





Peace...Mark
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lilitalienboi16

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Re: confused
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2010, 04:58:06 PM »

Obadiah 1:21 "And saviours shall come up on mount Zion to judge the mount of Esau; and the kingdom shall be the LORD's"

1 John 4:17 "Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world."

If He is the Saviour, we are the saviours. If He is the KING, we are the kings. If He is LORD, we are the lords.

Psalm 11:4 "The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD's throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men."

Acts 17:24 "God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;"

1 Corinthians 3:16 "Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?"

Revelation 11:15 "And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever."


I have more to say on this because its a huge subject but um......... I need to go get some cofee xD
« Last Edit: November 24, 2010, 05:42:02 PM by lilitalienboi16 »
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1 Cor 1:10 "Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment."

Deborah-Leigh

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Re: confused
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2010, 05:26:11 PM »

Hi Santikos

Your question is excellent.  :)

You ask..........how is HE (Jesus) coming back if He is now with us?

If He is with us, He dwells WITH us and IN us. That is how He is coming back ~ coming back, to us by dwelling with us and in us. Jesus says:

Joh 14:17  Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth Him: but ye know Him; for He dwelleth WITH you, and shall be IN you. 8)

By us KNOWING HIM ~ that He is in us and with us, we RECIEVE Him, which the world canít do.

1Co 2:14  But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Blessings
Arc
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santikos

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Re: confused
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2010, 10:10:50 PM »

Hi Santikos,

Try the Scripture below for confirmation. There are many other such verses that will help you to see.


(ASV).

1Co 3:16  Know ye not that ye are a temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

1Co 6:19  Or know ye not that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit which is in you, which ye have from God? and ye are not your own;


Wow, it was there all along. We are his temple.  It's amazing, we hear it so much that we sometimes forget the true meaning of his word.
 
We are saviors, thank littleboi.
 
Arc, you are correct, our carnal minds will never understand   
Mark, it's within us, it seems the word will never cease to amaze me.
1Co 6:20  for ye were bought with a price: glorify God therefore in your body.
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Kat

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Re: confused
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2010, 01:11:16 AM »


Hi Santikos,

Quote
He also said that jesus was in heaven and will come back. but if we are the heavens how is he coming back if he is now with us?

Yes there are a few that are His temple, He does come to those in this life, to those predestined to be His Elect and seals them with the Holy Spirit of PROMISE. Now in this life they receive the guarantee/earnest in their mind/heart/heaven.

Eph 1:1 In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will,
v. 12   that we who first trusted in Christ should be to the praise of His glory.
v. 13   In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
v. 14   who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

2Cr 1:22  Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.

So the few, in this life, have their mind/heaven "renewed" by the Holy Spirit.

Eph 4:23  and be renewed in the spirit of your mind,
v. 24   and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness.

But this renewing of your mind/heaven is to prepare the few to enter the first resurrection to rule with Christ in the next age, that's the guarantee. The hope we have is beyond this life, it's the resurrection.

1Cr 15:17   And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!
v. 18   Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.
v. 19   If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men the most pitiable.
v. 20   But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.
v. 21   For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead.

So yes Christ is indwelling for the few now, but will return to those in the grave, because they died with the guarantee.

1Th 4:16  For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
v. 17   Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
v. 18   Therefore comfort one another with these words.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

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santikos

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Re: confused
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2010, 02:28:23 AM »

Oops seem that I quoted everything earlier.

I really have some thanksgiving lunch & dinner & next day reheat with all of your inputs and scriptures.


Wow, it was there all along. We are his temple.  It's amazing, we hear it so much that we sometimes forget the true meaning of his word.
 
We are saviors, thank littleboi.
 
Arc, you are correct, our carnal minds will never understand   
Mark, it's within us, it seems the word will never cease to amaze me.
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