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In need of some clarification.
zander:
Yeah im still not clear on this.
Kat says:
"Zander, we will all be judged now or later. The Scripture are clear that now is the more desirable judgment, not to mention obtaining life eonian."
I understand this. But i dont have the desire to want that now. This is my point i am trying to make. Im given this "knowledge", but really i dont know what to do with it. As i say, im a normal guy, i do normal things. I am more wary of some sins than i used to be. However i still have my faults. And i sometimes think, with these faults and my knowledge, what do i do? I sometimes swear, i sometimes judge, i am a bit opinionated, i like girls (if yo uknow what i mean lol) but none of this is any more than your average guy.
Just seems unfair if i am going to get hammered for having something i didnt ask for and then having to be something i am not, with it. Hate to say this but for the first time it feels like when i was taught Church stuff that if i don't do a, b or c i would go to hell, whilst i was thinking "hang on, i cant help what i do.." Is there an answer that makes sense?
JohnMichael:
--- Quote from: zander on June 08, 2011, 04:50:58 PM ---Yeah im still not clear on this.
Kat says:
"Zander, we will all be judged now or later. The Scripture are clear that now is the more desirable judgment, not to mention obtaining life eonian."
I understand this. But i dont have the desire to want that now. This is my point i am trying to make. Im given this "knowledge", but really i dont know what to do with it. As i say, im a normal guy, i do normal things. I am more wary of some sins than i used to be. However i still have my faults. And i sometimes think, with these faults and my knowledge, what do i do? I sometimes swear, i sometimes judge, i am a bit opinionated, i like girls (if yo uknow what i mean lol) but none of this is any more than your average guy.
Just seems unfair if i am going to get hammered for having something i didnt ask for and then having to be something i am not, with it. Is there an answer that makes sense?
--- End quote ---
Zander,
What it sounds like here is your thinking that once you come to the Truth, you're suddenly going to wake up one day no longer desiring any sin whatsoever, righteous in every manner, and spiritually perfect. It doesn't work that way. It's a process. God does it in increments. He brought you to this Truth, and you will grow as He wills - in the timing of His will. We are just to do what we can as He gives us the strength and desire to. Pray, study, etc. He is the one that makes the changes - not us. We can do nothing without Him. Without His influence, we'd be out in the world partying like a rockstar - sinning to high heaven. Just be patient. :)
Blessings,
John
John from Kentucky:
--- Quote from: Kat on June 08, 2011, 03:38:49 PM ---
Well I think it is a matter of perspective, we all have our own way of looking at things.
John, it seems to me that you look at the hard cold facts and leave it at that. Where as I think of the attitude and emotions that are involved. Yes it is all of God, but the human factor plays a big part, as the work that God is doing in us is for OUR benefit. God's Holy Spirit indwelling is changing everything about us, mainly the way we think in our mind. Paul was not the same person when he was converted that he was as Saul and neither are we. The things that happened to Paul was all of God, but it was to change/convert him, his thinking, to bring him to understand and desire the will of God. So it is with us. God gave Paul great Revelations, so that he could express these truths. I certainly take his teachings to heart.
Php 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
You cannot ignore that, "work out your own salvation," God is doing His work in and through us, to change our thinking.
Php 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure.
Zander, we will all be judged now or later. The Scripture are clear that now is the more desirable judgment, not to mention obtaining life eonian.
Heb 12:25 See that you do not refuse Him who speaks. For if they did not escape, those who refused him that spoke on earth, much more we shall not escape if we turn away from Him who speaks from Heaven,
v. 26 whose voice then shook the earth; but now He has promised, saying, "Yet once more I will not only shake the earth, but also the heavens."
1Co 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we would not be judged.
v. 32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
Hi Kat,
I think you got it. I agree. I look at cold, hard facts. I am not that much into emotions, or touchy, feely things. In fact, too much syrupy emotions makes me sick. I can't take it.
I try not to waste mental energy on things I cannot control. That is what I meant when I referred to thoughts about the 1st resurrection as "futile". I understand that God has already selected the Elect who will be in the 1st resurrection. Therefore, what I think about it, or who may be there, is irrelevant. It's not my call. I don't get a vote. Why worry or think about something that I do not control?
Likewise, I do not like wars and killings. I do not like world hunger. I do not like sickness and disease. I do not like natural disasters as has recently occurred in Japan and Joplin, MO. However, since I cannot make things right, I don't worry about such things. I do take comfort that Jesus is Savior and will make all things right. I have great peace in that knowledge.
So I think you are correct. It is all a matter of perspective. I do not think those of us here have any fundamental disagreements.
John
zander:
"What it sounds like here is your thinking that once you come to the Truth, you're suddenly going to wake up one day no longer desiring any sin whatsoever, righteous in every manner, and spiritually perfect".
No, i am not thinking this way at all. I am thinking the exact opposite. Now i "know" these "truths", how do i deal with it? I know i am not waking up wanting to change. I am not changing. I am not in a place where i want to. I know i will have to, but that day isnt today. So whilst i "know" what i know, it seems unfair to get hammered if i dont start to follow it as i should. As i say, im an average, every day guy. I dont hate anyone (as far as i know, although i hate anything with Paris Hilton in it..lol)..yuo know what i mean?
Jeez, i sometimes wonder if i'd rather i didnt know what i know.
JohnMichael:
--- Quote from: zander on June 08, 2011, 05:49:01 PM ---"What it sounds like here is your thinking that once you come to the Truth, you're suddenly going to wake up one day no longer desiring any sin whatsoever, righteous in every manner, and spiritually perfect".
No, i am not thinking this way at all. I am thinking the exact opposite. Now i "know" these "truths", how do i deal with it? I know i am not waking up wanting to change. I am not changing. I am not in a place where i want to. I know i will have to, but that day isnt today. So whilst i "know" what i know, it seems unfair to get hammered if i dont start to follow it as i should. As i say, im an average, every day guy. I dont hate anyone (as far as i know, although i hate anything with Paris Hilton in it..lol)..yuo know what i mean?
Jeez, i sometimes wonder if i'd rather i didnt know what i know.
--- End quote ---
I misunderstood then. I'm sorry. God will give you the desire to change when He wants you to start. He brought you to the Truth for a reason, so time will tell how it will start to unfold.
John
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