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We will be changed
Kat:
Hi John,
--- Quote ---The matter seems to come down to: Are the Father and Jesus two separate beings? Two minds? Two wills? Two Gods?
Or, are They One God? One Mind? One Will? One Personality?
--- End quote ---
I can see how this appears to be one or the other, but maybe not. Here is a excerpt from the March Bible study.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,12896.0.html -------------
Did Jesus Christ say, I and My Father are one person? (John 10:30) No.
But here is what the Bible does say. In Genesis 11, this is the people speaking.
Gen 11:4 And they said, Go to, let US build US a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let US make US a name…
Everybody knows what that means, “us,” right? There is a whole bunch of people saying that, “let us.” Everyone understood the pronoun ‘us’ and what it stands for.
Gen 11:6 And the Lord said, Behold, the PEOPLE (multiple people, hundreds of thousands of people) is ONE…
Singular, all these people, “is one,” Hebrew ‘echad,’ meaning unified or one.
v. 6 …and they have all one language.
The next Lord, which is translated from Yahweh, this is not God Elohim. Now pay strict attention here. I thought if anybody has ever caught this, I’ve never heard of anybody catch this.
Gen 11:6 And the LORD (Yahweh, not Elohim) said…
v. 7 Go to, let US…
Now we have Yahweh saying “let Us.” So what is going on?
I’ll just say here the fact that God in the Old Testament most often uses the singular pronoun, He or Me or Mine, does not negate the fact that at other places it does use the plural.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
mercy, peace and love
Kat
John from Kentucky:
--- Quote from: Kat on July 27, 2011, 07:12:04 PM ---
Hi John,
--- Quote ---The matter seems to come down to: Are the Father and Jesus two separate beings? Two minds? Two wills? Two Gods?
Or, are They One God? One Mind? One Will? One Personality?
--- End quote ---
I can see how this appears to be one or the other, but maybe not. Here is a excerpt from the March Bible study.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,12896.0.html -------------
Did Jesus Christ say, I and My Father are one person? (John 10:30) No.
But here is what the Bible does say. In Genesis 11, this is the people speaking.
Gen 11:4 And they said, Go to, let US build US a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let US make US a name…
Everybody knows what that means, “us,” right? There is a whole bunch of people saying that, “let us.” Everyone understood the pronoun ‘us’ and what it stands for.
Gen 11:6 And the Lord said, Behold, the PEOPLE (multiple people, hundreds of thousands of people) is ONE…
Singular, all these people, “is one,” Hebrew ‘echad,’ meaning unified or one.
v. 6 …and they have all one language.
The next Lord, which is translated from Yahweh, this is not God Elohim. Now pay strict attention here. I thought if anybody has ever caught this, I’ve never heard of anybody catch this.
Gen 11:6 And the LORD (Yahweh, not Elohim) said…
v. 7 Go to, let US…
Now we have Yahweh saying “let Us.” So what is going on?
I’ll just say here the fact that God in the Old Testament most often uses the singular pronoun, He or Me or Mine, does not negate the fact that at other places it does use the plural.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
mercy, peace and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
Hi Kat,
Yes, I remember that from the March bible study. But Ray seems to be moving on from that study. Your quote from Ray's recent email, "I say IF they are separate Beings with separate personalities",is a very interesting quote. You quoted Ray accurately.
Yes, a most interesting journey do we go. "Trailing clouds of glory do we come." (Wordsworth)
No one can answer my questions except God or a teacher sent by Him.
John
Kat:
Hi John,
The March Bible study and the resent emails seems to be coming from the same study Ray is doing now. I can see how these things connect very well. But as Ray has stated several times there is so much more to these things.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
lilitalienboi16:
Maybe I'm very simple minded but I don't personally have a hard time understanding the relationship between the Father and the Son, our God. Maybe its because I was never taught this trinity thing, maybe its because I was never told how to look at our Father and our Savior.
I always think of this verse when I think of the relationship between the two.
Genesis 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
Matthew 19:5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
How many people? TWO. How many flesh? ONE.
How many beings? TWO (Father and Son). How Many minds, Gods, bodys? ONE!
Maybe i'm oversimplifying things... i don't know.
God bless,
Alex
Edit: What does Yahweh mean, according to ray? I know Elohim is plural form of God, I think. thanks :P
dave:
lilitalienboi16 alex. I like what you said somewhat my understanding as well. Yahweh, I beleve is Jehovah.
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