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Women being in submisson
Samson:
--- Quote from: Revilonivek on October 23, 2012, 05:34:14 PM ---
--- Quote from: John from Kentucky on October 23, 2012, 12:58:39 PM ---God does like to have His little jokes.
Who was the first human recorded in Scriptures to see and touch Jesus after His Resurrection? His close friends the Apostles? No. Who was it that was sent to tell the Apostles of the Resurrection? Some great manly man who was a leader of other men? No. ;D ;D ;D
It was a woman, Mary Magdalene, who loved Him greatly. Who had had problems with evil spirits. It was no accident she was chosen first to see Him. Love is the most important aspect of God, and she loved greatly. And her love was acknowledged with this special and unique privilege to see Him first. It also shows God holds women in high esteem and loves both His daughters and His sons.
--- End quote ---
So In other words, no one else said that except paul in the new testament. The thing is, you need two witnesses to establish every truth and no one backed Paul on that part in new testament. What Paul said is clearly sexist. It's one of the sensitive subjects so I'll leave it alone.
Denise
--- End quote ---
Hello Denise,
Here are the Scriptures that deal with Submission or Subjection and none of these discredit or devalue or limit a Woman's worth and how much God truly loves them.
The Apostle Peter speaks !
1Pe 3:1 Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;
1Pe 3:5 For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands:
1Pe 3:6 Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.
1Pe 3:7 Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.
Subjection: ὑποτάσσω
hupotassō
hoop-ot-as'-so
From G5259 and G5021; to subordinate; reflexively to obey: - be under obedience (obedient), put under, subdue unto, (be, make) subject (to, unto), be (put) in subjection (to, under), submit self unto.
G5021
τάσσω
tassō
tas'-so
A prolonged form of a primary verb (which latter appears only in certain tenses); TO ARRANGE IN AN ORDERLY MANNER, that is, assign or dispose (to a certain position or lot): - addict, appoint, determine, ordain, set. (caps for emphasis are mine)
Notice in 1Peter. 3:6 it mentions Sarah obeying Abraham, so Peter is referring to a situation taking place in Genesis.
Col 3:18 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.
Another Scriptural Witness at Colossians !
Obey: G5219
ὑπακούω
hupakouō
hoop-ak-oo'-o
From G5259 and G191; to hear under (as a subordinate), that is, to listen attentively; by implication to heed or conform to a command or authority: - hearken, be obedient to, obey.
Tit 2:5 To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.
So, altogether We have the following Scriptural Witnesses: 1) Ephesians. 5:22-24; Colossians. 3:18; 1Peter. 3:1,5 & 6; Titus. 2:5; Genesis. 3:16. That's five Scriptural Witnesses involving Paul, Peter & Moses through inspiration by & from God.
As stated earlier, this is an arrangement for Male & Female in the Flesh and none of the writers were sexist or intending to degrade Women. To support the highly accountable position that Men have in this arrangement if they don't treat their Wife properly, their prayers could be hindered if they don't honor their wives. Men will receive an accounting from their Spiritual Head, Christ.
Honor: G5092
τιμή
timē
tee-may'
From G5099; a value, that is, money paid, or (concretely and collectively) valuables; by analogy esteem (especially of the highest degree), or the dignity itself: - honour, PRECIOUS, price, some.
Hindered: G1581
ἐκκόπτω
ekkoptō
ek-kop'-to
From G1537 and G2875; to exscind; figuratively to frustrate: - cut down (off, out), hew down, hinder.
That concludes my contribution to this thread, don't know how to explain it any further, except to add a little Agape Love meant by God's intentions for Women.
Hope This Helps, Samson.
ICXCNIKA:
If I'm not mistaken, I believe Ray touched on what "subjection to her husband" means, i.e., Man is to love and protect her. Or something along those lines. Forgive the short response....(It's just a quick thought). ;D
Revilonivek:
Samson. I get it. But Paul said women are not to teach and are not allowed to speak and must remain quiet in church. That is clearly sexist. Peter said it with love and meant well. He also never said women shouldn't teach or speak and must be quiet in church either. But I'm sure Paul had his reasons for saying it but did u know that it is also a cultural tradition in jewish synagonues that women aren't allowed to speak at all and are seated in the back in Paul's time.
Dave in Tenn:
1. I don't go to an assembly, so I don't really care any longer what they do there. Let the strifes, envies and murders continue until those He is calling out repent.
2. If you do go, then do as Paul instructed. Or don't. There are plenty of silent women, and also some lesbian pastors at the other extreme. Somewhere in all of that--extremes or the middle--you can find a place to fit. Do what you want.
3. While you're there, I hope you can also find a few men who are Christ-like, able to teach their wives, and love them as Christ loved His church. Harder than finding a silent woman, I'm guessing, but the commandment stands for both. ALL this is about being conformed to His image. We've all got our challenges to live and HUMBLING to do. That's why Paul wrote what he wrote, under the inspiration of God. We ARE male and female in the flesh. We're going to be till we are saved from it. What comes after is the purification of what we lived IN it.
acomplishedartis:
There were laws, and behind each rule, there is the spiritual side of each one (baptizing, sacrifices, etc). Then Jesus said, your heard that ..........., But I say, Don't even think about it!.. Now, Jesus was dealing with the spirit behind the rule-the main attitude coming out from the heart.
When true believers get together in home bible studies and conferences, that's an assembly of believers, (like the first communities of believers on the beginnings).
I recognize that what Paul said sounds sexiest. But, that's just in the surface, you know...not everything is what in seems. Now, I doubt that when Paul was writing what he said that he was thinking so naively:''yes, men's are better than woman's'', (nor he was just repeating a custom of his time), No, there is more behind the rule, The real spirit behind the rule! After all he was the one who said that whatever we do with out conviction - is a mistake.
I believe there are MANY reasons why he said that, (I have some good ones in my mind-but I will keep them for my self), I am sure many here will be able to figure even more.
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