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Author Topic: Heaven  (Read 609 times)

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Anjel Uriel

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Heaven
« on: May 28, 2022, 03:09:04 PM »

Heaven

Hi brothers and sisters, I have a question. Itís about Heaven. If Iím wrong in my understanding please let me know cause these topic gives me a bit of trouble.

I know that contrary to what Christendom teaches, we donít go to Heaven when we die. We are in the grave with no consciousness or life (Ecclesiastes 9:5). As I understand from reading Rayís papers, Heaven is the mind of a person. The Babylonian king ďreachedĒ Heaven when he exalted himself in his own mind. We know God lives in His Elect and that The Body of Christ consisting of The Elect is known as The Kingdom of The Heavens. God is living inside The Elect and itís ever present in their hearts and minds therefore The Elect live with Christ and The Father because they are Godís Temple and Children.

However, I also understood that Heaven is not a geographical location in outer space but another realm of existence. You could call it ďthe 4th dimensionĒ, where the physical canít influence it but spiritual beings can not only interact with the physical through the human mind but also affect the outside physical world with things like the weather. Christ is in invisible to us but is He to the angels, who are spirits?

I right now ďseeĒ Christ but in my heart when I pray and in my mind when I read The Word and meditate on it. But I canít see his body and if He for some reason manifested His body to me in His glorified form then Iím certain I would die if I saw His face. However, He can not also see my body but also ďseeĒ my heart and mind.

I know that if we are chosen then when we are resurrected that we will have spiritual bodies like Christ has right now and that we will be invisible to flesh unless we manifest ourselves with a physical body like Christ did after His Resurrection. We will be able to see Christ as He truly is (1 John 3:2) and I read that verse as not only knowing Christ character and who He is totally but also seeing him bodily because we will no longer be flesh but also spirit.

Christ said that we would follow Him to where He was going and He ascended to Heaven but at the same time, when we die we donít pursue Him to Heaven but when He returns, He comes to us on earth. I donít know where it is but I read that Ray said that The Elect live and rule with Christ on earth. So is Jesus taking on flesh again since ďevery eye will see HimĒ (Revelation 1:7) and living on earth during His Kingdom ? Or will He be manifesting Himself physically occasionally like when He was resurrected and visited His disciples or will it be a totally spiritual rulership in the sense that He doesnít manifest Himself in the flesh.

Finally will The Elect reach Heaven not only in their minds but also in their spiritual bodies when they are incorporal?

Please have patience with me since Iím still learning new stuff every day and this is the only place where I can interact with people who know The Truth.
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The LORD answered, "Could a mother forget a child who nurses at her breast? Could she fail to love an infant who came from her own body? Even if a mother could forget, I will never forget you. Isaiah 49:15

Musterseed

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Re: Heaven
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2022, 07:17:34 PM »

Rev.5:10Ö and you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God
and they shall reign on the earth.

Rev.3:10Ö because you have kept my word about patient endurance,
I will keep you from the hour of trial that is coming on the whole world to try those who dwell on the earth.

From the Rapture Article

From Where Do We Judge?
All caps Rays.

Or are you not aware that the saints shall judge the world. And if the world is being judged by you
are you unworthy of the least tribunals?
Are you not aware that we shall be judging messengers, not to mention lifeís affairs.


Lifeís affairs is not something going on in outer space. Lifeís affairs are things on the earth,
which is the same location at which we will be judging messengers.

I have never gone into outer space but guess what? I still do wrestle creatures among the celestials.
Eph.6:2. For it is not ours to wrestle with blood and flesh, but with the sovereignties, with
the authorities, with the world mights of the darkness, with spiritual forces of wickedness,
AMONG THE CELESTIALS.

Now think for a moment, if we can right here and now , from the earth, wrestle with creatures
among the celestials, why canít we also judge and instruct them as well, FROM THE EARTH?

When Christ returns to set up His Kingdom on earth, He brings the place of authority or rulership
that He has prepared for the Apostles with Him so that ,,,,, where I am YOU ALSO MAY BE ( John 14:3)
During Christs reign on earth His Apostles will be with the Lord. Now notice 1 Thessalonians 4:17
where it is stated that when Christ returns to the Gentile saints,,, thus shall we always be together
with the Lord .
We will also be with the Lord on the earth, not in outer space.

The Rapture Article is so good.😃


Rev. 21: 3,,, and Lev.11:12,,, and I will walk among you.

Since Jesus can live in heaven and on earth at the same time and can manifest into anyone
He wants I have often wondered if maybe we have encountered Him on the earth.

This scripture comes to mind.
Heb.13:2Ö be not forgetful to entertain strangers , for thereby some have entertained angels
unawares.

Ray,,, God is in us while He is in heaven while He is also simultaneously EVERYWHERE.  Caps Rays.
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" No man can come to me,except the Father draw him"
                                   (John 6: 44)

zvezda

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Re: Heaven
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2022, 02:30:48 PM »

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Rev 21:1 Then I saw "a new heaven(3772 ouranos) and a new earth," for the first heaven(3772 ouranos) and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.

2 Cor 12:2 I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven(3772 ouranos). Whether it was in the body or out of the body I do not knowóGod knows.
2 Cor 12:7 even though I have received such wonderful revelations from God. So to keep me from becoming proud, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger from Satan to torment me and keep me from becoming proud.

3772. ouranos
Strong's Concordance
ouranos: heaven
Original Word: οὐρανός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: ouranos
Phonetic Spelling: (oo-ran-os')
Definition: heaven
Usage: heaven, (a) the visible heavens: the atmosphere, the sky, the starry heavens, (b) the spiritual heavens.

There are multiple heavens (gen 1:1)
The first heaven will pass away along with the first earth (rev 21:1), it seems to me, the first heaven is a visible heaven.
And then there will be a new one (rev 21:1), not sure if we can call it a second heaven.
Paul also was snatched away to the third heaven (the spiritual heaven), it's interesting that he didn't know if it was an out of body experience or not.

https://bible-truths.com/splinter.html
Only the trial of "blows" does Paul label "inordinately." Why? Is there something unique about this particular category of trial (blows?) Yes there is!

Fourteen years prior to writing II Corinthians, Paul speaks of being: "...snatched away to the third heaven...into paradise and hears ineffable declarations, which it is not allowed a man to speak" (II Cor. 12: 2-4). How big of a deal was this heavenly revelation to Paul? It was a giant, big deal. Paul said that it was a transcendent revelation (Verse 7).

Paul acknowledged that unless God would apply a counterbalance to him, he would surely, "... be lifted UP..." (Verses 7 and 8). The revelation was that " transcendent!"



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Anjel Uriel

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Re: Heaven
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2022, 01:35:00 AM »

Hi everyone, Iím sorry for not responding to the posts answers but I didnít have the wisdom to do so and Iím not sure I have even know. But, the reason Iím going back to this posts is because I found an email where Ray addressed wether we will ever go to Heaven, not only the renewing of our mind here on this physical earth but if we will ever reach Godís Abode.

Email: ďWhat Universalists Really Believe?Ē

https://bible-truths.com/email10.htm#universalist

Eternity in heaven is NOT the "REWARD" of the saved.
EVERYONE will eventually be in the realm of heaven with God
for eternity.
But ONLY those who are accounted worthy to be in
the first resurrection will receive a SPECIAL MARVELOUS
GLORIOUS REWARD. And what is that glorious reward:
"EONIAN [AGE-ABIDING] LIFE, in the KINGDOM OF GOD.
ruling and reigning with Christ's for "aions of the aions" until ALL
in the heavens and ALL in the earth, and ALL under the earth
[the deceased] are ALSO BROUGHT IN GOD'S FAMILY! It is a
special reward to occurs AGES before the rest of humanity
receive salvation. This reward is all through the New Testament,
but few indeed, seem to see it.
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The LORD answered, "Could a mother forget a child who nurses at her breast? Could she fail to love an infant who came from her own body? Even if a mother could forget, I will never forget you. Isaiah 49:15
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