> General Discussions
Conceived again
Harryfeat:
--- Quote from: bobbys43 on September 11, 2006, 08:55:32 AM ---I don't think the bible is the be all and end all to our search for truth, however I accept the limitations here for it to be the basis for our discussions.
Hi Feat and I lurk for I worry about you all here at this forum.
Your quote disturbs me so let us see what the WORD of God has to say about your comment.
Deuteronomy 4:10 Specially the day that thou stoodest before the LORD thy God in Horeb, when the LORD said unto me, Gather me the people together, and I will make them hear my words, that they may learn to fear me all the days that they shall live upon the earth, and that they may teach their children.
Deuteronomy 8:3 And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna, which thou knewest not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live.
Deuteronomy 12:28 Observe and hear all these words which I command thee, that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee for ever, when thou doest that which is good and right in the sight of the LORD thy God.
Psalm 119:9 Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word.
Psalm 119:11 Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.
Psalm 119:42 So shall I have wherewith to answer him that reproacheth me: for I trust in thy word.
Psalm 119:105 Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Psalm 119:116 Uphold me according unto thy word, that I may live: and let me not be ashamed of my hope.
Psalm 119:130 The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple.
Psalm 119:140 Thy word is very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it.
Psalm 119:160 Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever.
Psalm 119:169 Let my cry come near before thee, O LORD: give me understanding according to thy word.
John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
bobby
--- End quote ---
Hello Bobby,
Thank you for those quotes. I appreciate and take some comfort in them. However, I don't see anywhere in the quotes that says to rely only on the bible as the only source for His word but to heed the word that is written there. Perhaps I just am unable to see the limitation.
I apologize for making you feel uneasy or uncomfortable by expressing my opinion. Frankly, I am surprised that you find it disturbing to believe that truth and understanding can also come from sources other than the bible. I quote you from your previous post..."When God speaks through us with His Sprit I am thankful to HIM that I have those eyes and hears opened to see it and hear it."
Did you truly mean it when you said the Holy Spiirt speaks to you? Is this not a source of truth outside of the bible?
I truly believe that the bible is a very significant tool for us but not the only source of truth. I apologize in advance if this offends anyone but it is where I am. Please understand that I agree with much of what Ray interprets from the bible. I am still studying and am not yet quite in total agreement.
As far as the bible goes here are a few hypothetical questions that might help me to explain myself. PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT THESE QUESTIONS ARE NOT EXPECTED TO BE ANSWERED BUT ONLY TO HELP YOU TO SEE WHERE I AM.
-The bible is a collection of scripture which has been badly or inaccurately translated. Much of what we have been led to believe about eternal torment results from it. true or false Does that mean we should discount the whole thing?
-God chooses who He chooses. Do we expect that God will limit his choices to only those who have read the bible?
-When we are inspired by the Holy Spirit, does His inspiration bring truth to us? Does the Holy Spirit inspire only those who read the bible.
-Are there sources of God's truth told to us from outside the bible? Do we experience brotherly love by reading the bible or interacting with them?
************************************************************************************
Enough with the hypotheticals or someone will accuse me of trying to teach. These kinds of things run through my mind whenever anyone trys to limit my thinking or create a basis for me to start excluding others as my brothers. Someone else tried to make the point of asking whether there has been anything else of God's inpired word given to us in the last 2000 years. I found the question intriguing because if everthing.... is, was, and will be ....then why wouldn't God be speaking to us today?
Getteing back on topic, I still need to listen to the tape. Perhaps someone knows which tape discusses the concept of conceiving vs rebirth.
In any case, Bobby, I hope this eases your concern. If you or any of the other moderators believe that, from what I have said that I am not like minded (however you define it) with the rest of this group then please delete me from the membership rolls. I have no wish to a source of divisiveness.
feat
snorky:
Anyway, here's what I think, since I have considered this issue elsewhere...regarding John 3:8
"The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and wither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit." This verse means that GOD, not man, sends the Holy Spirit to those He chooses to send it to, at the time of His choosing! I am not sure it means those chosen are invisible (well, maybe the spirit is...certainly, those who put on incorruption are not flesh). Jesus saves, whereas it is taught that "we" can "save" others "for Jesus" which is hogwash. But there is probably more to it than that.
I have to wonder about all the divisiveness that occasionally crops up here. I am NOT taking sides, but I really think that not only is the Bible simply put (though spiritual discernment is never easy...iut must be GIVEN), but it is also logical, because knowledge of one precept God given leads to more knowledge God given and a logical connection to prior knowledge. But as to Feat's posts, he may have a point...what God reveals in the Bible is what He CHOOSES to reveal to those seeking the truth at this time (or age or whatever). For instance, it doesn't explain things that we don't necessarily need to know but would be interesting to learn, such as what God looks like. We don't need to know that, but that doesn't mean there isn't such a thing. The Bible doesn't explain Chinese civilization though God fomented it. The Bible doesn't explain how the continents divided in the time of Peleg; it doesn't explain why (the process) whereby Lot's wife turned to salt. It doesn't explain the scientific processes, genetics, etc. Maybe that is what Feat was saying, and not trying to belittle the Bible.
snorky
hillsbororiver:
Hello Snorky,
You are (as well as others) entitled to your opinion(s). In regard to physical science and worldly things often one opinion is just as valid as another. Some things science has nailed, on others people with equally solid backgrounds are diametrically opposed.
In regard to the Word there is no such ambiguity, although the denominations mix man made philosophies with the Word we are scripturally admonished not to add to or take away from what is written.
2John 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ , he hath both the Father and the Son.
2John 1:10 If there come any unto you , and bring not this doctrine receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed.
2John 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
I hope you can see where we are coming from,
Joe
snorky:
Joe you are right, and I agree with what you are saying. However, what I meant to say but I guess got muddled, was the God has revealed to us all we know (and I do not and did not intend to "add" to it or "take way" from it)...yet He has not revealed to us all He knows! That will come at a time of His choosing. I am not about to argue with you on this; however, I, Feat, you and others here are on a journey to truth and some are at various stages (six months ago I believed in the rapture, so obviously I am at a much more early stage than many here). Basically what i am saying is that though a poster may be wrong, the responses to these wrong ideas are sometimes a bit overbearing. That's my 2 cents, but, we are, after all, flesh with the intention of wealking in the spirit and have light hearts.
snorky
hillsbororiver:
Hi Snorky,
I certainly agree that patience and longsuffering are traits we all should be seeking, when someone has a question that is asked in a humble spirit we are obligated to answer as a loving brother or sister and not as the stern, unforgiving schoolmaster.
Patience and brotherly love are true fruits of the spirit, things all of us should be striving for.
Thank you for the response.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version