> General Discussions
Us and Them
worm:
Amen Craig & Rocky!
the Scripture you quoted speaks for itself :D 8)
Deedle:
1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.
1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.
1Jo 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
Jam 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.
Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)
Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob [chosen] have I loved, but Esau [called] have I hated.
Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
2Ti 2:20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
Rev 17:14 These ["them"] shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they ["us'] that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
Mar 13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
The word "continue" in the above scripture is the same greek word translated "abideth" in the scripture here.
2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
Now back "to those Jews which believed on Him".
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Heb 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal [aionios] judgment. [UR]
Heb 6:3 And this will we do, if God permit.
2Co 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
2Jo 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
2Jo 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
Deedle :D
orion77:
I agree with ya, worm. The way I see it, I can do nothing of my ownself and am not worthy to see what I see now. Just because I see clearly now, does not make me any better than the ones who don't now. Also, the day will come when they also shall see clearly.
It all boils down to having a love for our neighbor and forgiving our enemies. God loved us while we were blind, so we should love our other brothers who can not see clearly now.
I was once where they are now, yet now by the grace of God I see the light. God is no respecter of persons and I from the knowledge given shall not see my other brethren in a different perspective, for I am no better than they.
It's all in Gods own due time.
God bless,
Gary
Phazel:
--- Quote from: worm ---hey guys,
one thing I've realised when coming to the realisation of UR, is that there is NO MORE "US" and "THEM"...
it is alarming for me to still find on UR sites people referring to others as "they do this"..."they do that"..."thank God I'm not so blind anymore as them"..."they are perverting the word of God" etc etc
shouldn't the more "enlightened" ones be just that...a light in the darkness? but without pride, without being "superior"...but in love...like guides of light towards the bigger Truth?
shouldn't we strive to build bridges for people to safely "come out of Babylon"?
shouldn't we have the heart, mind and love of Christ for ALL people?
yes, even "those in the Harlot" system?
if we can't even love our brothers who are still drinking milk, how are we to love the unbelievers?
as God loves us ALL unconditionally, no matter whether we are chosen, elect, harlots, unbelievers...His plan is to save us ALL...we're not ALL on the same path...not yet...but we WILL be :D
so NOW...there's only "US"..."THEM" should be no longer in our vocab
anyway, just had to get this "off my chest" :wink:
--- End quote ---
I understand your point. As a new convert so to speak, I find my outlook still to be them and us, but I feel different spiritually.
No longer will my witnessing be influenced by trying to "Save someone from the oncoming Truck" rather a message of truth and love to others.
My "them and us" references does not carry with it the negativity it once did. At least I do not believe so. I am more than willing to be shown, with scripture, an error in my comments around here, that is for sure.
rocky:
--- Quote from: Deedle ---1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.
1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.
1Jo 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
Jam 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.
Rom 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)
Rom 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob [chosen] have I loved, but Esau [called] have I hated.
Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
2Ti 2:20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
Rev 17:14 These ["them"] shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they ["us'] that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
Mar 13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
The word "continue" in the above scripture is the same greek word translated "abideth" in the scripture here.
2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
Now back "to those Jews which believed on Him".
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Heb 6:2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal [aionios] judgment. [UR]
Heb 6:3 And this will we do, if God permit.
2Co 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
2Jo 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
2Jo 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
Deedle :D
--- End quote ---
I think Paul did a great job of hating the world (the churches sin, the pride, the adultery, the fornication, the law keeping), but loved the person so much he died daily for their salvation. He lived his whole life humbled by God for the salvation of the world (church).
Christ is the savior of the world. Christ in us.
1Cr 2:1 And when I came to you, brethren, I did not come with superiority of speech or of wisdom, proclaiming to you the testimony of God. (Paul came to them, yet he himself had come out)
1Cr 3:9 For we are God's fellow workers; you are God's field, God's building. (Paul is the fellow worker, to the field (world/church)
1Cr 4:14 I do not write these things to shame you, but to admonish you as my beloved children. (the church, carnal man, his beloved children)
1Cr 4:15 For if you were to have countless tutors in Christ, yet {you would} not {have} many fathers, for in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel.
1Cr 4:16 Therefore I exhort you, be imitators of me.
1Cr 4:17 For this reason I have sent to you Timothy (again, he sends Timothy to them, the very ones we are to be out of) who is my beloved and faithful child in the Lord, and he will remind you of my ways which are in Christ, just as I teach everywhere in every church.
2Cr 1:6 But if we are afflicted, it is for your comfort and salvation; or if we are comforted, it is for your comfort, which is effective in the patient enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer;
2Cr 2:4 For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote to you with many tears; not so that you would be made sorrowful, but that you might know the love which I have especially for you.
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