> General Discussions
Is there any truths coming out of the present apostate church today?
Bradigans:
Galatians 5:9 says - A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.
This is how Satan got Eve...
mari_et_pere:
--- Quote ---Could it be the church has not only lost its ability to discern truth from error, but also to discern the true sheep from the wolves?
--- End quote ---
Heck yes! I can remember a time that I was attending my "non-demoninational" church, and they thought I was just absolutely ON FIRE FOR GOD. SUCH A BLESSING. A GREAT MAN OF GOD. But I wasn't any of those, really. I was totally stagnate, just like them. They don't know what they're talking about. Many of them don't even know what they believe. It makes me so sad that I can't pull my wife out of there.
Matt
Kat:
I think the churches knowledge of Christ is very shallow. They do have a degree of comprehension, but it is greatly limited by what the carnal mind can see. They build their religion on their lack of knowledge, and that has produced the many churches, operated by the doctrines of men. I was thinking it is sort of like a Christian country club. But that is the way God caused it to be, and it is where we first hear of Christ.
It is that blindness that we all had to go through, as a part of the process to learn whatever God is teaching by that experience.
God is only opening the eyes of a very few, for a special purpose in His plan. God blinded the world and He is going to keep it that way, until this age ends at the return of Christ.
We don't hate the church, it's just disturbing when your eyes are opened, to see how messed up it is. We can't change the way it is, nor can we save a single person whom God has blinded, unless He has chosen them. We may want to look around and talk to people and see if we can witness and help them see the truth, and that may be God's means to bring them to the knowledge of the truth. But I think if God has chosen someone, He will make sure they find the truth one way or another. So I personally don't worry about witnessing, if God sends someone to me, it's a joy to share the truth.
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
skydreamers:
--- Quote ---We don't hate the church, it's just disturbing when your eyes are opened, to see how messed up it is. We can't change the way it is, nor can we save a single person whom God has blinded, unless He has chosen them. We may want to look around and talk to people and see if we can witness and help them see the truth, and that may be God's means to bring them to the knowledge of the truth. But I think if God has chosen someone, He will make sure they find the truth one way or another. So I personally don't worry about witnessing, if God sends someone to me, it's a joy to share the truth.
--- End quote ---
Amen to that!
Peace,
Diana
mrsnacks:
--- Quote from: Kat on May 23, 2007, 10:17:30 AM ---
I think the churches knowledge of Christ is very shallow. They do have a degree of comprehension, but it is greatly limited by what the carnal mind can see. They build their religion on their lack of knowledge, and that has produced the many churches, operated by the doctrines of men. I was thinking it is sort of like a Christian country club. But that is the way God caused it to be, and it is where we first here of Christ.
It is that blindness that we all had to go through, as a part of the process to learn whatever God is teaching by that experience.
God is only opening the eyes of a very few, for a special purpose in His plan. God blinded the world and He is going to keep it that way, until this age ends at the return of Christ.
We don't hate the church, it's just disturbing when your eyes are opened, to see how messed up it is. We can't change the way it is, nor can we save a single person whom God has blinded, unless He has chosen them. We may want to look around and talk to people and see if we can witness and help them see the truth, and that may be God's means to bring them to the knowledge of the truth. But I think if God has chosen someone, He will make sure they find the truth one way or another. So I personally don't worry about witnessing, if God sends someone to me, it's a joy to share the truth.
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
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Well said Kat.
I at one time thought the theologians had the truth. Well one doesn't get doctorate degrees in theology and philosophy unless one studies. So I went after these teachers. I took courses and had bought over a thousand books and I don't mean the pop Christian books. And I would get to a point where I thought I was getting truth and knowledge of God etc. I wanted to be smart for God so He could use me. Then I would look at my life and see that it was a mess. I was carnal and couldn't at all live the Christian life. I was a failure.I was still a slave to my passions and the flesh. But I knew a lot and spent much time accumulating knowledge and debating the skeptics and unbelievers. I was doing this all for God.
But I realized one thing. There is always someone smarter than you. And I ran into some tough skeptics.This was humbling. And all this studying was exhausting. I wasn't a person anymore but a walking texbook of facts and arguments. So I quit the knowledge thing for awhile and God showed me my lifestyle was the key. If my life didn't reflect Christ then all the knowledge don't mean a thing. If Christ wasn't real in transforming me and I had very little fruit showing in my life then what good is all this knowledge.
And in the process I learned about dying to the flesh. Christ living in me. And learned about God's love for me was not dependent on my performance. Also in the journey most of what I learned I have found to be false.You know the tune- free will, hell , and etc. Spending years learning theology and apologetics from the best professors around I have discarded. I will tell you why. Because I started to depend on my logic and arguments to win someone over. I had pride thinking I knew more than the average person and looking at people who didn't believe like I do as a potential debate. Relying on my understanding. So it was game of intellectual gymnastics. Then God showed me that it was His Spirit that opens the eyes of the blind and gives understanding. Not me. Not my arguments and skill.
So much in christendom is head knowledge. Or if not that then it's a belief relying on emotions. The truthfulness of the gospel isn't because it gives you the warm fuzzies. Did Paul ever say the gospel is true because it makes him feel good or because he feels it's true ?
Don't get me wrong- I am not saying apologetics and all that is wrong. I know a lot of how to defend the gospel and answer objections etc. But I don't rely on that knowledge. If God brings something to my mind then so be it. But I look at people as people now. Not as someone to debate with or argue with into the Kingdom. I see a person as one who is loved by God and in the process. And the most important thing is that they see the Christ in me and not me.
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