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Islam. (anyone know anything about Islam?)

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rk12201960:
You know that's whats wrong with religion its always put before God.

I guess it all depends on which God you believe in, the god of religion or the God of Creation.
It would help to read Rays papers "The Lake of Fire" and you would understand why all religions are so far off from the true Word of God.

many are called, but few are chosen.

Randy

CDJ:
Hi :-)

With difficult topics, I usually go and try and find the origin of something... and take it from there...

Genesis 16:9-15 "...And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands. And the angel of the LORD said unto her, I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude. And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Behold, thou art with child and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishmael; because the LORD hath heard thy affliction. And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren. And she called the name of the LORD that spake unto her, Thou God seest me: for she said, Have I also here looked after him that seeth me? Wherefore the well was called Beerlahairoi; behold, it is between Kadesh and Bered. And Hagar bare Abram a son: and Abram called his son's name, which Hagar bare, Ishmael..."

Genesis 21:12-18 "...And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called. And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he is thy seed. And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba. And the water was spent in the bottle, and she cast the child under one of the shrubs. And she went, and sat her down over against him a good way off, as it were a bow shot: for she said, Let me not see the death of the child. And she sat over against him, and lift up her voice, and wept. And God heard the voice of the lad; and the angel of God called to Hagar out of heaven, and said unto her, What aileth thee, Hagar? fear not; for God hath heard the voice of the lad where he is. Arise, lift up the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great nation..."


:-)

mari_et_pere:
A couple paragraphs from Wikipedia.

Muslims believe that God revealed the Qur'an to Muhammad, God's final prophet, and regard the Qur'an and the Sunnah (the words and deeds of Muhammad) as the fundamental sources of Islam.[3] They do not regard Muhammad as the founder of a new religion, but as the restorer of the original monotheistic faith of Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and other prophets. Islamic tradition holds that Judaism and Christianity distorted the messages of these prophets over time either in interpretation, in text, or both.[4]

Islam includes many religious practices. Adherents are generally required to observe the Five Pillars of Islam, which are five duties that unite Muslims into a community.[5] In addition to the Five Pillars, Islamic law (Sharia) has developed a tradition of rulings that touch on virtually all aspects of life and society. This tradition encompasses everything from practical matters like dietary laws to practices like jihad.[6]

Almost all Muslims belong to one of two major denominations, the Sunni and Shi'a. The schism developed in the late 7th century following disagreements over the religious and political leadership of the Muslim community. Roughly 85% of Muslims are Sunni and 15% are Shi'a. Islam is the predominant religion throughout the Middle East, as well as in parts of Africa, Central and Southeast Asia, and the Indian subcontinent. Large communities are also found in China, Western Europe, the Balkan Peninsula, and Russia. Only about 20% of Muslims come from Arab countries.[7]

Muslims consider the Qur'an to be the literal word of God; it is the central religious text of Islam.[22] Muslims believe that the verses of the Qur'an were revealed to Muhammad by God through the angel Gabriel on many occasions between the years 610 and his death on July 6, 632. The Qur'an was written down by Muhammad's companions (sahabah) while he was alive, although the prime method of transmission was orally.

Thanking God I'm not Muslim

Matt

Pax Vobiscum:
O my o my o my o my.....  I know I shouldn't....  But I know I will anyway (well, maybe just a little bit).... Aha!  Since there is no free will, this isn't really me that's writing this ......!?

Islam is simple just as Christianity is simple just as Judaism is simple.
Islam is complex just as Christianity is complex just as Judaism is complex.
Islam's followers are given to religious violence just as Christianity's followers are given to religious violence just as Judaism's followers are given to religious violence.

I think it is healthy to explore all of the world's religions; so not to be curious about Islam would be silly.  The problem is that an awful lot of people start out with a questions like "Why is Islam wrong?" or "Why should I hate Islam?"  With questions like that, good, honest answers are hard to come by.

That America is a "Christian Nation" is another thread entirely. 

Muslims do believe that the Qur'an is divine.  Actually, I believe that many Christians wish that they could make as strong a claim for the Bible's divinity!

Arabs were already worshipping Al-Lah (the God -- same as El Shaddai, etc...), had pride in the Kabah, were making pilgrimages to Mecca, and had a pre-Islamic faith before the Prophet went into his cave at Hira in 610.  Remember, that the Arabs were worshipping the same God that we claim -- the God of Abraham.  Yet they sufferered an anxiety -- God had sent prophets to the Jews and Christians, but were the Arabs forgotten by Al-Lah?


In 610, Muhammad was awakend by an angelic presence which told him to "Recite!" (iqra!)  Just like our Jewish prophets whom we believe at their word, Muhammad was reluctant to utter the Word of God.  The angel's presence sqeezed the stuffings out of the Prophet and commanded him again!  By the end of the third embrace, Muhammad was reciting the first words from God spoken in Arabic.  This (over the course of some 23 years) would eventually be written down in the Qur'an, which means the "Recitation."

He was so powerfully moved that he flung himself out of the cave to kill himself when another angel stopped him -- this was the angel Gabriel (yes, the one and same as the story goes).  So, bit by bit the Qur'an was recited by Gabriel, then recited by Muhammad (they say he was illiterate), and written down scribes.

Here is where many people jump way out of line.  This is an important point in order to complare Christianity and Islam -- The Qur'an is so central to Islam, that it should be compared to Jesus (the Logos), not the Bible.  For Christians, Jesus is the manifestation of the Logos (not the Bible); for the Muslim believer, the Qur'an is that borne directly Al-Lah.  This is a common mistake (and, I believe, that many Christian belief systems try and make them equal in importance to their respective religions -- they are not.  Period.).

So when a Muslim quotes the Qur'an, it carries the weight of Paul's verbal account of his encounter with Jesus on the road -- not the writing about it later.

As another interesting parallel to early Christianity, Muhammad's early preaching was not about founding a new religion, but about refining (in Arabic terms) the old ways of interpreting Adam, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, et al.  Are the quotes attributed to Jesus about founding a new religion, or about refining the old ways of interpreting Adam, Abraham, Moses, etc...?

Now, Muhammad's Islam was merely a surrendering of oneself to the Creator.  Once that was done through a recitation, one could be called a Muslim.

Once one gives over to Al-LAh (remember, this is the God of Abraham), one needs follow the 5 pillars (rukn) of Islam of which alms-giving and prayer are two of the pillars.

This should be enough to get you started learning more about Islam.  I do not wish to break any "teaching" rules -- I seek only to edify the body.  Islam is no more our enemy than is Judaism, orthodox Christianity, Eastern Orthodoxy, Catholics, or anyone else who searches for the One.  Hey, throw Jerry Falwell and Billy Graham on that list!

Let's be more like Jesus and less like the John Birch Society!

Peace

gmik:
Yikes!

My son spent a year in Pakistan. He dressed in their clothing, smoked their pipe, and drank tea w/ them in their home.  He has deep respect for Muslim PEOPLE. But not ISLAM!!  Don't paint it w/ such a rosy color Pax.

sORRY, but the koran also speaks badly about a lot of things. The things the Pakistanis think about Jesus is not that He was a fine prophet- no, lunatik more like it.  You cannot mention to a Muslim that Mohammed died w/ a child "wife", and the warring and killing etc of his followers. The trials they put on women is deplorable.  I could go on and on but I shan't.

The Talmud of the Jews is pretty rough on Jesus also.

To want to know and understand about all religions is fine I guess.  I had to take World Religions in college.  We all hate religiosity and Churchianity. But there are many verses in koran that do talk about Jesus in a disparaging way.

My daughter taught at a school in Switzerland and had a few of the Saudi nephews.  Loads of stories, but one time she just asked if she could see a copy of Koran,  They all but shouted at her and wagged their fingers, NO NO Never.  You a woman will never read it.  You don't need to know anything!!

My son traveled in India, (and my doctor is Indian Christian from Goa), and same thing--Indians have a lot of traditional misunderstandings about Jesus-crazy stories etc.

Again, its not the people, its their belief system that has been duped on them.  According to God's plan.

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