> General Discussions
What If?
joyful1:
Joe--
I'm still trying to get a grip on your original question....
perhaps you could pose a hypothetical situation, in which a certain type of "vessel" brings a certain type of "message" to another certain "vessel"--
(this whole conversation is reminding me of that whole silver ephod, Babylon thingy you once questioned)...but back to the original question...
Joyce
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: joyful1 on June 08, 2007, 10:23:29 AM ---Joe--
I'm still trying to get a grip on your original question....
perhaps you could pose a hypothetical situation, in which a certain type of "vessel" brings a certain type of "message" to another certain "vessel"--
(this whole conversation is reminding me of that whole silver ephod, Babylon thingy you once questioned)...but back to the original question...
Joyce
--- End quote ---
Hi Joyce,
I can veer all over the place with the very best of them Sister! ;)
What I wanted to discuss is how we can sometimes not see some wisdom, or a truth or a revelation because who it is that is presenting it to us, for whatever reason we can become jaded or calloused in the way we see some of our brethren. I believe there are times God will use people we tend to shy away from or even not be particularly drawn to to bring us knowledge and how we react or respond to it is a witness either for us or against us.
You know it seems that all things in this life have a place in our spiritual growth, how we act and respond to our family, friends, coworkers, strangers on the road, in the stores, on the street. You know how some (not all) in the churches are Sunday for an hour christians who don't really take heed of or have any interest in those who are not in their group, their denomination.
My question was, do we ever catch ourselves doing that? I know I have and it is something that can sneak up on a person and be virtually unnoticed to the person doing it.
Discernment in our interactions and treating others as we would like to be treated, truly listening and keeping in mind that the Lord sacrificed Himself for all men therefore all men are bought and paid for by Christ and we disrespect Him if and when we devalue any of the brethren. Not that we should be still when heresy or outright deception is presented but we can challenge an action or statement without forgetting the ultimate value of everyone in the eyes of God.
Gee, I hope I didn't just make it worse! ??? :D
His Peace to you Sister,
Joe
mari_et_pere:
Deep thread! I don't even know if I have anything to add to the great responses. I think we probably miss opportunities every single day.
I think discerning correctly relies a lot on our attitude. See if I can keep ya following me on this. I don't trust myself to say this right but here it goes. :D
In my 32 years I've had a lot of "upstanding christians" shatter people's emotions. I have so many examples I can't even think of which one to use! These supposed good, prayer warrior type women being totally nasty to others, sometimes within their precious church walls!
On the other hand, I've had people who were rough and tough, down and out, beer drinking, cussing folks who had hearts of gold!
I'll give a good example of the former. A guy named Jon in my church was seeing a girl named Erin. Jon never thought it was all that serious, but she had other plans. Erin's mom was a huge figure in the church. You know how some folks are back row every sunday and that's it, and others are up front speaking, testifying, holy fire burning bla blahblah.....well Jon started dating my sister in law. They hit it off and eventually announced their engagement. Well the woman I spoke of.......how do I say this? She got so nasty, so vile, so over the top jealous and angry that she became a total fool. (I'd already seen her fake tongue talking "look at me be holy" testimonies in front of the church was nothing but religious addiction.) While others were busy talking about how shocking her behavior and jealousy was, I was busy thinking "I knew it. I knew it. She's no good. She's fake." And I'd laugh inside at her.
How wrong was she? BUT HOW WRONG WAS I?!?!? How am I any better to laugh and scoff inside, even when technically I'm right about her being a nutjob and a faker. I'm not better for I'm created equal! And the Lord knows all I've done wrong. They were different wrongs in a different setting, but wrong all the same.
If this woman came to this forum and started pulling her fake "look at me I am here and holy" wool over your eyes, I'd rush out to tell you how fake she is, how she only does it to puff herself up. And while I would be right, I'm not the person to do that.
I feel that I'm nobody to tell any of you anything. I was a crazy, crazy teen/young adult! CRAZY! I should be in prison still. While I've confessed before Jesus Christ and am forgiven, I'm also still guilty. I've done things that would make you think twice about me I'm afraid.
But even though I've done some terribly stupid and evil things, I've had people tell me how much I've helped them. HUH? Me? I don't understand why God would use me at all. But I'm honored that He has. At the same time, he's using that woman who's full of herself and lives to prove her religious dominance over others everyday. He uses us all, wether we're righteous or evil, heavy metal singer or choir singer, murderer or social worker.
I guess what I'm saying after a long winded response is: Our attitude shouldn't make us look AT the person or their actions, but it should make us HEAR what is coming out of their mouth.
Mat 12:34 O generation of vipers, how can ye, being evil, speak good things? for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.
Those beer drinking, cussing, hard living people I know, sometimes they have a more pure heart than the respected church goers that I know.
Mat 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure [OF THE HEART] bringeth forth evil things.
You'd be suprised who you'll find a good heart in sometimes. :)
Sorry for the ramling post! ::) :-[ ::)
Matt
Deborah-Leigh:
Joe
Perhaps this comment fits here in your thread.
I have been thinking about that Scripture that says Work out your own salvation in fear and trembling. Now before anyone thinks what has that got to do with your questions....just pause a moment. WHAT IF the words WORK OUT mean....find out...or figure it out...are you in the first or second resurrection?
Then we have to look at our choices that are caused by His Hand to find out where He is setting our Salvation. Either in the LOF or our painful lessons and judgments in this life. Like Russian Roulette....gun at the head sort of fear and trepidation....if I pull the trigger of finding out will I be shot dead or will I have another chance at life.
I have been studying Job and he said in a question to his friends Job 21 : 30 The evil man is now spared in the day of calamity and destruction, and they are led forth and away on the day of God's wrath.
So if one is feeling slighted or disappointed at where our lessons are ensuing, it may be that we are not going to be led forth and away on the day of God's wrath into the LOF!
Peace be to you
Arcturus :)
YellowStone:
--- Quote from: Arcturus on June 08, 2007, 12:29:31 PM ---Joe
Perhaps this comment fits here in your thread.
I have been thinking about that Scripture that says Work out your own salvation in fear and trembling. Now before anyone thinks what has that got to do with your questions....just pause a moment. WHAT IF the words WORK OUT mean....find out...or figure it out...are you in the first or second resurrection?
Then we have to look at our choices that are caused by His Hand to find out where He is setting our Salvation. Either in the LOF or our painful lessons and judgments in this life. Like Russian Roulette....gun at the head sort of fear and trepidation....if I pull the trigger of finding out will I be shot dead or will I have another chance at life.
I have been studying Job and he said in a question to his friends Job 21 : 30 The evil man is now spared in the day of calamity and destruction, and they are led forth and away on the day of God's wrath.
So if one is feeling slighted or disappointed at where our lessons are ensuing, it may be that we are not going to be led forth and away on the day of God's wrath into the LOF!
Peace be to you
Arcturus :)
--- End quote ---
Arcturus, you pose a very interesting question: WHAT IF the words WORK OUT mean....find out...or figure it out...are you in the first or second resurrection?
Your question I feel is based on Philippans 2:12
Phl 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
As you say, our choices are caused by his hand.
Phl 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure.
For God's good pleasure. Could this possibly mean that God puts one in a position of great amusement to him? :)
I am sure that He has smiled or perhaps outright laughed at some of my futile attempts of being righteous in His eyes. :D
But all of this aside, by what measure should we gauge our choices? Well Paul offers the following in the next two verses. :)
Phl 2:14 Do all things without murmurings and disputings:
Phl 2:15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;
The above offers enough information to perform a pretty good spot check at any given moment.
Paul uses the words Murmurings and Disputings:
Murmurings: goggysmos [G1111] - Pronunciation gon-gü-smo's
1) a murmur, murmuring, muttering
a) a secret debate
b) a secret displeasure not openly avowed
Disputing: dialogismos [G1260] - Pronunciation dē-ä-lo-gē-smo's
2) a deliberating, questioning about what is true
a) hesitation, doubting
b) disputing, arguing
If one finds that they are harboring any such tenancies, then surely one is not blameless and neither harmless.
In fact, such tenancies are in direct conflict with the Spirit of Truth.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness
Surely then, if our choices, thoughts, words, actions or motives do not bare the fruits of: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness then we by all means should tremble and fear.
But, we are not without hope: For we must be like children, meek and mild; fully realizing that one cannot guarantee ones salvation free of the LOF, but rather God who works all according to His will. Therefore, as innocent children being meek and mild, worrying not of the future knowing that the responsibility is not theirs to bare. Such children know that they have no control over what tomorrow might bring and become not anxious. For...
Ecc 2:22 What does a man get for all the toil and anxious striving with which he labors under the sun?
Therefore...
Phl 4:6 Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God.
Requests like asking and petitioning for wisdom that allows walking and talking the fruits of the Spirit.
I believe that this is the charter that we have been given.
I think this fits well with your end statement: :)
So if one is feeling slighted or disappointed at where our lessons are ensuing, it may be that we are not going to be led forth and away on the day of God's wrath into the LOF!
I could be wrong! Comments welcome :)
Love to you in Christ,
Darren
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version