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A question of NT emphasis
Tom:
Arcturus,
Thank you for the list of teachings by bro Ray. As I mentioned previously, my comments are not based on surface study in this area. I have actually read everything bro Ray has to say on this topic. What I have not seen addressed sufficiently is this issue of NT emphasis.
My studies show me that this issue could go either way. In other words, there may be endless torments, and there may not be. There may be judgments and spiritual fires unto purification and deliverance, and they may continue indefinitely. The end of judgments may very well be annihilation, or they may not end, or they may lead forth to salvation. The words studies alone have left me inconclusive at this point, and unwilling to settle with either those who maintain endless punishment, or those who see annihilation, or those who see deliverance and salvation after judgments.
If, as you see, the writers have such a positive understanding as you indicate, I don't understand why they are as seemingly unsuccessful at communicating their optimism. Why are they so pessimistic, as relates to the outcomes of judgment, when they address the theme of judgment?
Thank you for your patience with these questions!
Tom
Craig:
--- Quote ---Why are they so pessimistic, as relates to the outcomes of judgment, when they address the theme of judgment?
--- End quote ---
Are the writers pessimistic or the translators? Is it possible the translators had an agenda at the time? History shows how corrupt religion and its leaders where throughout history, do you think it is possible they disguised and camouflaged the "good news" of the scriptures?
One other thing, judgement will not be a walk in the park and will be a very painful experience for most, and that is what the writers warn of.
Just some thoughts.
Craig
Tom:
Hi Craig,
Thanks for your input!
I suppose it is possible, that the translators put their biased spin on verses relating to the nature of judgment, but because I don't personally have a bias, simply a hunger for truth, having carefully studied these passages from the Greek, while I think they could have done a far better job in translating Aionios, the emphasis they portray seems pretty close to the actual emphasis of the Greek texts.
I'd love to see a far more consistent dealing with Aionios, and see it translated "age," implying brackets (...) indicating beginning of an age and ending of an age, but I think the translators biases hindered them from doing this. But, when it came to picking up and accurately communicating the tenor of these writers sentiments on judgment I think they did a pretty good job. The writers, for whatever reason, just don't seem to have a positive outcome view of divine judgments.
Certainly we would have to agree that not all judgments "in time" have positive outcomes for the offenders. The stories of scripture portray very negative outcomes, at least in this life, for those who persisted in sin and were harshly dealt with by God. Whether we are viewing the Canaanites, or the 185,000 Assyrians, or the various other enemies of Israel, and including the generation that was judged and drug off to Assyria, their outcomes in this life were horrible. Nothing positive there.
Therefore, it would seem reasonable to ask of at least a few NT writers the question "Do you see a positive outcome of judgment in the coming ages, and if so, where do you describe those positive outcomes?" I just don't find any examples. If they are there I would appreciate someone pointing them out for me, because I've missed them.
Thanks again Craig!
Tom
Craig:
Tom,
I wanted to also say I know where you are coming from. For the years I was in Babylon I wondered what and where was the good news? Preachers and teachers would tell of the good news, but deep in my being I could not see the "good news" they spoke of. I saw a god of failure and most all the people I have ever known and cared about was going to spend eternity in hell.
When God opened my eyes to the truths of scripture I see the good news as plain as day, it was always there, but hidden in the dirt of religions covering. When I study scripture now the bible is like a new book. And the good news is in every page.
Craig
GODSown1:
Hey hi TOM & Welcum 2 da Forum,
Much Blessnz 2 U, um! wot came 2 mind wen I read wot U had 2 say & want 2 know. Was Yes hw do we know da Truths/Mysteries of GOD had been recieved by dez writters of da NT den?. Wen we ourselves r jus startn 2 c dem here n da Forum n 2007, Well d@s about all I can say & feel Willed 2 :), b strong & Patient ma Brother in CHRIST.
muchLOVE!! Pera
ps. xcuse ma way of writing TOM lol! :)
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