lake of fire on earth?

[hillsbororiver]

I have been reading the first party of Ray's lake of fire series, and copied it to Word to go through it at my leisure so I can absorb  the truths I find there - but one thing bothers me and it is getting in the way of my concentration. It could be that Ray answers this issue elsewhere. if so, my apologies for an unnecessary post.

I get the  strong impression from Revelation 19:17 on that the  scene is being set for Armageddon and that the location is  earth, and that this is where the beast and the false prophet are thrown into a lake of fire (v20).  How does this fit in with Ray's teaching I wonder?

Hi Pawz,

There certainly is a lot to study, absorb and meditate on, what can really inhibit us on our quest for spiritual wisdom is impatience, this can and will turn into frustration if left unchecked. By that I mean to attempt under our own power to understand everything now, that is not the way God works, in His plan and purpose for us is to develop a spiritual patience that is but another step in our spiritual growth.

I have seen many come through the Forum who after a quick review of the articles on Bible Truths come here with question after question that really are answered quite thoroughly in the articles, sometimes a member can rephrase or underline a point made but the scriptural meat is bountiful in these papers and they must be studied independently with our bibles at hand, we cannot gain wisdom by attempting to do it with the "Readers Digest" versions.

One thing (of many) that used to bother me about the (traditional) teachings on "the beast," "antichrist," and "end times" scenarios is the fact that all the time between Christ's ministry and resurrection seemed to be a vast wasteland, the only people that seemed to count whether it be for good or bad either lived in the time of Jesus or at the time of His return, "the last days." I had a difficult time with this and all the "Christian" books on the subject muddied the already murky water of my understanding.

The following helped me immensely.

This is a very small portion of "The Beast Within" http://bible-truths.com/lake14.html


Everyone in religious circles is looking for the beast, OUT THERE somewhere. If we are to find the beast OUT THERE, we might question whether he was ever IN HERE? That there "is, was, and will be" a beast OUT THERE, I have no doubt. But of what great concern is that to us? The only beast we need to concern ourselves with is the beast "within," "the man of sin." Just as the many-member beast comes "up out of the sea" [of humanity], we too came up out of the sea of humanity.

Ten times in Revelation, Jesus Christ is spoken of as "The First and the Last," The Beginning and the Ending," the "One Who IS, WAS, and WILL BE." Do we think that the Scriptures speak these ten times in vain? Is the beast of Revelation something with which only the last generation at the end of this age needs concern itself? Was the book of Revelation written for the last generation only? Of course not. The book of Revelation, which is the testimony of Jesus Christ was given to the Seven Churches of Asia—Asia representing the whole world and seven representing the complete and total church.

Some will retort: "Beast? What beast? I don't see any beast within myself. I am not perfect by any means, but I am certainly not a beast." We shall see.

Please read this article after reading Part 13 (WHO IS THE BEAST?) http://bible-truths.com/lake13.html

I can only say it really opened my eyes, this had bothered me from the time I was about 17 until I read it and reread these articles at age 51, 2 1/2 years ago. You are correct in saying this battle rages on earth (as well as heavenly places), in every believer's life in every generation at some point, that will hold true in this age or the one to come as we know all creation is to become not only believers but worshippers, Sons and Daughters of the Living God!

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe

[pawz]

thank you Joe,  I will go there tomorrow.. appreciate your  sincere efforts to help, that counts big

[dave]

This is a first time for me. Im lost on how to ask a question so Im trying this,only lost on how to use the computer and posting. I believe and have accepted for some time Rev. is a book of symbols.  My question is, what about the book og Genisis, esp. 1-5   

[Kat]

Hi Micah,

I'm glad you have joined us 

Look at the top right of the board you choose and you will see these
'Mark Read  |  Notify  |  New Topic  |  Post new poll' 
To ask a question or start a new topic pick 'New Topic,' then type out your question and give the subject of the question and post.
You should go to the 'Introductions, Announcements, and More of Ray's Teachings' board and tell us a little about yourself, that a good ice breaker.

You ask this; what about the book og Genisis, esp. 1-5   
Ray is working on a paper for Genesis, the days of creations, for a conference later this year. 

mercy, peace and love
Kat

[hebrewroots98]

Hi Pawz,
We love you Brother!!!!

God bless you!
Susan

[pawz]

Susan, hello back and thank you. I am feeling chirpier today. Off now to do a bit  more on  the Revelation study.

[hillsbororiver]

thank you Joe,  I will go there tomorrow.. appreciate your  sincere efforts to help, that counts big

You are very welcome Pawz,

If you have any questions from/about the articles please toss them out here, there are quite a few folks willing and able to lend a hand and give an insight.

His Peace to you,

Joe

[pawz]

Will do Joe. I have  just finished going more carefully through part 1 of LofF and am now mulling it over, pondering, seeing where it fits, see where I have to adapt and modify my views, what it then infers for other parts of my understanding, etc.

Have to say, have no great problems so far. One teensy criticism in that I would have thought it would be better to get the meaning of the verb for  'signify' direct from the Greek sources (same word in Alexandrian, majority texts and Textus Receptus), and see how the word is used in other places in scripture, rather than to use even such a respected book as Websters (or any other) to define its meaning - but  overall I have to say 'yes Ray, I agree with you ( and how can I not) that the book of Revelation IS a book of symbols, and that it is 'crooked thinking' to assign symbolism and figure to one part and insist on literalcy (is that a real word or did I just invent it?) in another.'

[hillsbororiver]

- but  overall I have to say 'yes Ray, I agree with you ( and how can I not) that the book of Revelation IS a book of symbols, and that it is 'crooked thinking' to assign symbolism and figure to one part and insist on literalcy (is that a real word or did I just invent it?) in another.'

Literalcy? 

Works for me Pawz! 

Peace,

Joe

[pawz]

thanks Joe. Had to go out  and fetch a poorly computer back tonight, and will be working on it from tomorrow, so won't be able to get my teeth into much  more of Ray's writings for a bit, but when I do come back on here I will start a new thread as this one is getting a bit long. Night-night all (yawn)

[aktikt]

Pawz,

You have me remembering my own journey when I first came across Ray's site.  I had been searching for some time and was feeling miserable all the time.  I was tormented by freewill and predestination which had hell as a backdrop.  I couldn't get my mind around how free will could exist at the same time as predestination with hell as a consequence.  Hell made God out to be a monster and I hated God for what I thought He was.  Boy, was I wrong...

The joy I found when hearing the Truth was deep and profound especially in contrast to the depression and loathing I was feeling.   Don't give up, you're in for some jawdropping truths.

Josh

[hebrewroots98]

Right on Josh, jaw dropping for sure

[gmik]

Hey, welcome Micah.  You sorta snuck in there.  Please don't be shy.  we love newbies!

[pawz]

Hello folks, as this thread is still active, just wanted to say sorry I haven't got back to you ( and hello Micah ).  Computer jobs are like London busses - they always come close together, and since I  wrote, saying one had come in and I would not be able to  study Ray's teachings for a couple of days, I have had several others (I fix them for free for all the folk in our church, and a few outside). I am beginning to flinch when the phone goes now. But I will be back to start a new thread - want to talk about us being made in God's image and about  'children of Satan' and how it all fits together...

night-night now