> General Discussions
Wars? Government? ----
gmik:
To use the reasoning that all is God's will so if an intruder entered my house to rob, kill, or pillage I should do nothing or turn the other cheek, is to also believe then that I should not go to a doctor since God must want me to be ill, sick or cancer, and I shouldn't try to intervene. If I am walking a trail in the mtns and a bear comes at me should I just accept it or try to defend myself? We are potter's clay, not robots. God has given us reasoning capabilities with some common sense. Since we always don't know what God's will is at the exact moment, then all our experiences, knowledge, love, maturity etc etc come into play. To defend yourself or your family is not the unforgivable sin. My husband's role is a protector and to not take care of your family first you are worse than a reprobate( infidel Or something like that-I know its a verse in the Bible :oops: ) How did the topic switch from war and government to this, or am I on the wrong thread? Anyway, my 2 cents.
rvhill:
--- Quote from: gmik ---To use the reasoning that all is God's will so if an intruder entered my house to rob, kill, or pillage I should do nothing or turn the other cheek, is to also believe then that I should not go to a doctor since God must want me to be ill, sick or cancer, and I shouldn't try to intervene. If I am walking a trail in the mtns and a bear comes at me should I just accept it or try to defend myself? We are potter's clay, not robots. God has given us reasoning capabilities with some common sense. Since we always don't know what God's will is at the exact moment, then all our experiences, knowledge, love, maturity etc etc come into play. To defend yourself or your family is not the unforgivable sin. My husband's role is a protector and to not take care of your family first you are worse than a reprobate( infidel Or something like that-I know its a verse in the Bible :oops: ) How did the topic switch from war and government to this, or am I on the wrong thread? Anyway, my 2 cents.
--- End quote ---
Gandhi argument to this is very compelling, but for me it is very hard to accept. It goes something like this:(I can't find the quote)
If you are godly, and your family is also godly, then if you and your family die you will be with God. If the Ungodly die were will they be? If by you and your family example the ungodly may be lead to God, then your death may serve God purpose.
I am not saying I would let someone kill me and my family, but I do see and understand Gandhi's logic here.
Joey Porter:
--- Quote from: Kevin ---Joey you asked what our motive will be. My motive would be love. For I love my family and friends. I could not stand idle and watch a loved one get killed. If something happened so fast, I dont think I would be thinking hate, rage, or vengeance. I would be thinking protect my family.
Lets say someone came into your home and started hacking your family. You mean to tell me that someone is gonna just sit on the couch with a coke in their hand and watch it happen. Im sorry but thats just not thinking realistically. I know for me that I would do everything in my God given power to stop that person.
I pray to God that nothing like this will ever happen to me or anyone else reading this.
--- End quote ---
I have meditated on this for most of the day and have come to the strong conclusion that we would be putting ourselves under the letter of the law if we stood by and watched our family getting harmed without taking action - simply because we were trying to obey the commands of Christ. We are under a new law - the law of the spirit. Who in their right mind would not feel their spirit crying out to intervene if they were seeing their daughter getting molested or abducted, or their mother being assaulted? To stand by and do nothing would be utterly insane, and I believe it would be a sin. As pointed out by a previous poster, men are instructed to take care of their family.
Looking at some people's views of God's sovereignty, they seem to think there is no reason to do anything at all. But then, why would Ray have even started his site to expose those who contradict? Why do Mike and Ray have bible conferences? Why pray? Why does anybody do anything?
Why not take the reverse view? Intervene against someone who is brutalizing your family and if it's God's sovereign will for them to be brutalized, He will find a way to stop you from intervening. But the idea of just sitting back and letting anything happen, assuming it's God's will, is just crazy.
The point of Christ saying to turn the other cheek and to love our enemies is so that we have a forgiving Christ like spirit toward all people in our daily walk. It is instruction on how to live our lives as a whole, not for a specific moment in time in which our loved ones could be in extreme danger.
Likewise with Him not retaliating when He was being tortured before the crucifiction, He refrained from returning evil for evil as an example of how we are to live our lives (not to mention the fact He understood full well what had to happen to fulfill the scriptures). He allowed His flesh to be destroyed (literally) as an example of how our flesh needs to be destroyed daily over the course of a lifetime. I really don't believe that we are expected to just let someone beat us to death.
Kevin:
Well said Joey.
Mt26:53-Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
Why did Jesus pose this question?
bobf:
--- Quote ---Who in their right mind would not feel their spirit crying out to intervene if they were seeing their daughter getting molested or abducted, or their mother being assaulted.
--- End quote ---
Do you think Christ can not see when these things occur? And yet He does not generally intervene to put an end to it. Do you remember when Stephen was being stoned? He looked up to Christ before He died. Christ was watching.
Nobody is saying not to do anything about anything. What we are to do is immitate Christ who did not return evil for evil. When he was reviled he reviled not. When he suffered He did not even threat in return. Instead He commited Himself to God who judges righteously.
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