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Author Topic: 23 Minutes In Hell.  (Read 8744 times)

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Richard D

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23 Minutes In Hell.
« on: November 10, 2008, 01:39:57 PM »




I feel so embraced after listening to Rays July 208 bible studies on 23 minutes in hell. I find myself asking one question? How in Godís creation could I have believed in the concept of the greatest Christian hoax known to mankind?

Itís truly humbling to me as I look back towards former beliefs I once believed in have now become so silly to me after learning the truth concerning this Christian hoaxís that God has revealed through Ray.

I feel so blessed by God that he leading me into His truths. To understand something that millions of people donít understand is indeed a great blessing from God our creator.

Let us never forget the precious pearl we have all found here in a field we have not purchased.  ;)


                                                In Godís Love. Richard.
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Ninny

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2008, 03:33:29 PM »

Richard it's like getting a new lease on life, isn't it? Freedom is such a breath of fresh air! My husband makes this dumb remark anytime I  say "I want..."  He says, "Yeah well there's people in hell wantin' ice water too, but they ain't gettin' it!" Now I just look at him and say, "Oh really?" Ha! I've listened to how Ray says it!  ;D

I love your analogy "...precious pearl...found here in a field we haven't purchased." Loved it, I say and how true!
So blessed we are!
Kathy :)

 
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Longhorn

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2008, 03:51:14 PM »

Richard,   I feel all of us at one time or another have spent 23 min in hell, (13 yrs myself, my ex said it was more like 30)  That kinda hurt my feelings. 

Love in Christ


Longhorn

See, I do have a sensitive side.
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Marlene

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2008, 04:30:54 PM »

Richard, I had hated Hell for years. But, there were times that I did not think of it. Ray talked about how if anyone really thought about Hell very long they would  more or less give up. Not sure his exact terms, but he believes we don't think about it long . He is right there were times I thought of it and times I did not. But, it got to where I thought of it enough to hate it. I hated my life when I sinned and I thought why not just die and go there now. Well, I thought of it too long right before I came in her. Actually, just the word Hell typed on the internet led me to freedom. I was sad and without hope. So, now I am glad I went through the Hell of my mind so that I could be sat free of that sickening thought. I have peace in my life for the first time and not fake peace.

In His Love,
Marlene
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Richard D

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2008, 05:11:58 PM »

Kathy, Long Horn and Marlene.

I wanted to express my gratitude and delight in knowing the truth concerning the greatest hoax about our creator known unto the human race.


Lets face it, there are millions of people who went to their graves believing and fearing what would happen to them at death and still there are millions more who are living with this fear.

But we here have been greatly blessed with this knowledge and although we know these people who have die with this fear are really dead and are not suffering.

I wonder how many people who are living cry at night for their loved ones believing they are being tortured in a place that does not exist and hating God because of it?

I pray I never take for granted the truths that are taught here and keep growing in knowledge because itís this very knowledge through Christ that truly sets us free.

But free from what? Free from fear of the unknown because we know, free from hate because we learn through the spirit, love, peace, forgiveness, charity, patience, and every good thing that comes down from heaven unto us His children. 

I pray I never forget the precious pearl I found in a field I did not purchase but was given me with love that I might live with the hope of being His elect but knowing without doubt that every person from every nation no matter what language they speak will be saved and brought into the family of our God.

So blessed are we here who have been given His truth and we who have rejected the false doctrine of man and accepted the real truth of God.  :)


                                       :)  In Godís Love. Richard.  :)
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David

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2008, 06:42:24 PM »

Another thing that we should never lose sight of, the doctrine of eternal hell is far and away the most despicible hate filled vile lie that mankind has ever concieved of, it surpasses all wickedness.  It is one of the two orthodox Christian doctrines that none believers object to the most and turn away from Christianity because of it. The other being the one that Ray has recently been teaching on, the foolishness of young earth creation.
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Kat

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #6 on: November 10, 2008, 07:42:08 PM »


Hi David,

Quote
eternal hell is far and away the most despicible hate filled vile lie that mankind has ever concieved of, it surpasses all wickedness.

I agree.   What has occurred to me is that our loving Father has created for us in this life a fail-safe to keep humans from suffering too much.  And that is of course death, we can only suffer so much and the body dies.  He could have designed us to live a certain amount of years, but no this way assures no one suffers beyond a certain degree.

No wonder people fear dying so much, the church has proclaimed to the whole world this most vile doctrine against our loving Father.  How could anyone love a God they believe capable of creating a hell??  They accuse Him of something we have proof He does not do here, in the actual fact that people's suffering ends and they die.

I am so very thankful that I do not hold this horrific notion of my Father in my mind.  What a tremendous blessing to know the truth and it does set one free to know how truly loving and wonderful our Father really is.

mercy, peace and love
Kat

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Richard D

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #7 on: November 10, 2008, 07:46:50 PM »

David.

Your so right about that, itís like I was saying how many people cry because they believe a family member is being tortured. I used to believe in the hell doctrine and I know first hand how devastating it can be.

My dad was not a bible reading man if you know what I mean and I used to wonder after he had died about what he might be going through but thank God this was nothing more than a lie and whatís worst is that it was more than likely done to create revenue.

But now having the truth I forgive all those who lead me to believe in this Christian hoaxís and more than likely they believed it themselves too.

Itís all apart of Godís purpose but Iím thankful I have been lead to the truth and now know itís a hoaxís and after the resurrection all of humanity will too.

 
                                                In Godís Love. Richard.
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Jackie Lee

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #8 on: November 10, 2008, 08:34:55 PM »

When my dad died at 50, I cried almost every day for 5 years sometimes constantly it never left my mind.
I wondered how I was to go on living knowing he was in such horrific torture and pain.
Then one day God relieved my mind I just didn't think of hell anymore.
I wince now over 30 years later, it brings tears to my eyes.
This is the doctrine I grew up with Hell that was basically it.
This still saddens me so much.
 A couple years ago someone gave my husband a book "Divine Revelation of Hell By Mary Baxter" he read it and believed every word. Give him a bible it will go unread unopened.
He believed I was going to hell for not believing in this hell and that all would be saved eventually.
Unfortunately he still believes in this hell and it is fair and loving.
What gets to me also, how those that believe in their miserable hell thinks they are the ones that will never go there no matter what they do after all they believe their good news gospel of Hell.
Thanks for this thread Richard, if anyone has the link by Ray 23 minutes in Hell handy would they post it here. Thanks!
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Richard D

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2008, 09:27:18 PM »

Hi Jackie Lee.

I probably should have put the link on this thread without anyone having to ask. My apologies for not having done so.

Below is the link I was listening to.

You will need to scroll down to the July bible study and youíll find 23 minutes in hell.


                http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,8256.0.html

« Last Edit: November 10, 2008, 09:34:51 PM by Richard D »
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Akira329

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2008, 09:35:21 PM »


Hi David,

Quote
eternal hell is far and away the most despicible hate filled vile lie that mankind has ever concieved of, it surpasses all wickedness.

I agree.   What has occurred to me is that our loving Father has created for us in this life a fail-safe to keep humans from suffering too much.  And that is of course death, we can only suffer so much and the body dies.  He could have designed us to live a certain amount of years, but no this way assures no one suffers beyond a certain degree.

No wonder people fear dying so much, the church has proclaimed to the whole world this most vile doctrine against our loving Father.  How could anyone love a God they believe capable of creating a hell??  They accuse Him of something we have proof He does not do here, in the actual fact that people's suffering ends and they die.

I am so very thankful that I do not hold this horrific notion of my Father in my mind.  What a tremendous blessing to know the truth and it does set one free to know how truly loving and wonderful our Father really is.

mercy, peace and love
Kat



Hey Kat your comment brings Psalm 90:10 to mind:
Psa 90:10  The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

Antaiwan
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"Only a life lived for others is a life worthwhile"
-Albert Einstein
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
- Jesus

Marlene

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2008, 12:49:00 AM »

Hello All, I have to share this with you. Friday night I was in reading Ray's papers. He gave a verse that basically says it all. I had been talking with an older neice last night. She knows, I do not go to church anymore. Also, she knows I believe in salvation of all. I also, have a friend who had left my old church because of how the pastor was treating people . She calls me often and one night I shared this with her. She is so interested in doing some studies of Rays papers and Bible Studies with My Mother, Husband and Me.

Any ways this is the verse that really did it for my friend, and mother, and husband. It is one Ray said, "You will never hear them preach on."
John 12 verse 47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not; for I came not to judge the world , but to save the world.

Well, last night I got to read this to a older neice who went to two years of Liberty University and had to leave because my father who was the only father she ever knew passed and she was not able to handle it. My sister had been raped and this is how her birth came about. So, she lived 11 years with me so that she could get a good job. I had her look that scripture up and she believed it. I told her I could give her many scriptures. Last night I shared that verse with a friend from my old church and she believes it.

To night my younger niece who is 21 called me. Her Dad has been ill for last 7 months. Tonight, he passed away. She called me wanting to talk to me. He is divorced from my sister he had been abusive to my sister, cheated on her and also mistreated my neice. She still loves her Dad and they had made amends. Even, my sister cried at his death. Well, tonight I was able to share with my neice whose father just passed away. She passed out when he died. I believe God had be rereading that paper so that I could share with all of those people.

My neices all want to read his papers and learn all of the verses of salvation for all. I was so blessed to comfort her tonight. Plus, it gave her great hope. I told her just like we love people who hurt us, our Father loves us even more. I know that God planned me to talk to my friend, both of my neices and it has also helped my sister who is paralyzed from a stroke. My older neice is her care giver and also works for a hospital.

You, know a pearl is of great value and we all have found many pearls. Ray has surely been sent of God to teach us such an amazing thing. We are all blessed to have each other and my Love for all of you and your post are beyond words.
Love is contacious.

In His Love,
Marlene
Amazing one verse changed several minds.
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Akira329

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2008, 01:33:12 AM »

Thats Great :D!! Marlene
I wish just one person from my family could see these truths!!

Antaiwan
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"Only a life lived for others is a life worthwhile"
-Albert Einstein
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
- Jesus

David

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2008, 12:58:33 AM »

David.

Your so right about that, itís like I was saying how many people cry because they believe a family member is being tortured. I used to believe in the hell doctrine and I know first hand how devastating it can be.

My dad was not a bible reading man if you know what I mean and I used to wonder after he had died about what he might be going through but thank God this was nothing more than a lie and whatís worst is that it was more than likely done to create revenue.

But now having the truth I forgive all those who lead me to believe in this Christian hoaxís and more than likely they believed it themselves too.

Itís all apart of Godís purpose but Iím thankful I have been lead to the truth and now know itís a hoaxís and after the resurrection all of humanity will too.

 
                                                In Godís Love. Richard.


Hi Richard.

I had an experience relating to my youngest brothers death just over two years ago (it would have been his 40th birthday today.) I live a few hundred miles away from the rest of my family, and so my pastor at the time had no idea until I told him about it.
My brother was killed by a drunk driver. I was actually asking my pastor about the issue of forgiveness and how I was having difficulty with it. I told him all about what had happend. The first thing he did was not to help me with forgiveness, not to offer any comfort as Christ commanded in Matthew 5:4, no no, what he did was to ask me in a very urgent manner if my brother was "saved". I knew instantly where he was going, and also knew instantly that my time with that Church was up. My brother was not a Christian, had no interest in religion at all. He was just an ordinary hard working family man. But according to my pastor my kid brother is now burning in hell and will remain there forever.
I'd been familiar with Rays teaching at that time for about 6 months, and so I knew I had this guy on the backfoot if I just stuck with the scriptures. Also something just popped into my mind that I believe God planted in me right there and then, which I call "eternal misery for all". I asked him what hope I had in Christ if my brother was burning in hell forever, at what point do I just forget about him and rejoice that I got saved and he didn't? He couldn't answer me. I asked him what insentive there was for the rest of my none believing family to be saved? I asked him how my mother could ever love God or Jesus Christ if her youngest son has been condemned to hell because he missed his chance by being killed by a criminal? He couldn't give me any answers. I wrote him a formal letter saying I was quitting the Church and I've never seen him sinse. I often wondered if God had yet converted that twisted mans heart and mind, but a few weeks ago I had no need to wonder any more. I close friend of mine had coffee with him, and he apparently asked "How is David? Has he given up fighting against God yet? It saddens me that he's following his poor brother straight to hell now that he's given up on the Church." Clearly God has not seen fit to convert him yet. 
The depravity of this doctrine needs to be constantly and vigilantly exposed at every given oportunity that God presents to us.
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keys2heaven

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2008, 04:01:18 PM »

Thank you for sharing this.

I also wonder about the reciprocal book titled "90 Minutes in Heaven" by Don Piper. This gentleman came to the church I attended at the time. Although his story was compelling, I had a hard time believing it. I know that Ray teaches that Heaven is not a real physical location nor has any one of us been there. So, should these books be discounted as well?
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Richard D

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2008, 04:13:22 PM »

Hello Keys2heaven.

The dead are really dead, their not in heaven or hell but simply destroyed or out of existence, one's thoughts perished in the day one dies.

If anyone tells me they been to heaven or hell and have come back I would not put any faith in what they are telling me.

                                     In Godís Love. Richard.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2008, 04:15:23 PM by Richard D »
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Richard D

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2008, 04:37:00 PM »

David.

I apologize for not responding right away to your reply, I was heartbroken as I read your story about your younger brother. Your story is heart felt my brother. Itís very sad and hurtful when people parrot things that arenít true through a lack of knowledge.

I want you also to know how much joy I felt inwardly when you had mentioned you had been reading Rayís work about six months prior to this unfortunate loss of your brother, I was so thankful to God you knew the truth about your brothers destiny.

I thought the question you had presented to your minister at the time were very valid question any family member would want to understand the faith of their loves ones and its sad he had no consolation to give you from the scripture.

Your right about getting the truth out there so many people can be spared further despair. I would like to believe this minister was like me and honestly believed in hell rather than knowing the truth but withholding it.

One day all of humanity will know the truth after the resurrection and how foolish will these who teach and preach the hell doctrine feel when they stand face to face with those who they taught such foolishness.

My heart goes out to you my brother.

                                                       In Godís Love. Richard.
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David

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2008, 07:13:29 PM »

, should these books be discounted as well?

Yes  ;D
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indianabob

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2008, 10:02:51 PM »

Folks,

I agree with the posters who have said that this "hell" doctrine is a painful, distressing lie, but I wanted to add that there are some who are modifying it a little out of compassion for their church membership.

A group that I attended for a while is working away from the lie gradually by teaching that we do not suffer in hell forever, but rather are annihilated shortly after resurrection to judgment in the "lake of fire".  That is supposed to give the living members peace of mind to know that God isn't torturing their loved ones, but simply putting them out of their misery by applying the second death.  Of course it still leaves the impression that God's plan is a failure because there were some who were so evil OR so unappreciative of God's gift that they could not be saved.

They are a loving and basically helpful group and I was treated with great respect while fellowshipping with them. But they seem not to realize that the God they worship is an impotent God who started with a perfect creation that simply got out of hand and there is nothing He (God) can do about it.

I realize that this is a sad state of affairs, but they are confident in their error and I have stopped attending or trying to enlighten them.  The difficult part for me was that many are still friends that I see regularly in local stores and coffee shops.

Indiana Bob
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Richard D

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Re: 23 Minutes In Hell.
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2008, 01:23:56 AM »

Hello Indianabob.

Have you made mention of these scripture to your friends Iíll put below, you can discuss these over with your friends and see if they will understand what these scriptures are really telling everyone.

  Rom 8:20  For the creation was subjected to vanity, not of its own will, but by reason of him who subjected it, in hope
Rom 8:21  that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the liberty of the glory of the children of God.
Rom 8:22  For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
Rom 8:23  And not only so, but ourselves also, who have the first-fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for our adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.


The next time you see one of your friends give them these verses and ask then if they can tell you what they are saying to them and take it from there.

                                             In Godís Love. Richard.
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