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Why Did Jesus Miss one Passover? John 6:4
hillsbororiver:
Hi Kat,
Thank you for your input, my point is that these accounts are much deeper than some literal, historical biography of physical events that transpired 2000 years ago. There are spiritual meanings behind these accounts that I believe lie beneath the surface.
In one of my earlier posts on this subject (in this thread) I referenced Christianity's belief that humanity has one shot at being "saved" and that this opportunity is presented in this age and this age only, we know better than that, what I think I am seeing in this "day difference" is another witness that the sacrifice of Christ covers those in the 1st and the 2nd resurrection, not only the first and everyone else is doomed "forever." The Passover Lamb covers both (all) ages/resurrections!
Here is another interesting bit since you mentioned John 19:14;
Joh 19:14 And it was the preparation of the passover and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!
Compare that with;
Mar 15:25 And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
I am not going to speculate here what this might mean other than I am absolutely sure the Holy Spirit did not make a mistake and that there is a deeper meaning within these verses than what time of day it might have been.
Back in December of 2006 I noticed how John's account of Jesus cleaning the Temple differed from the other Gospels, I may not have nailed the premis but there is something going on within these Gospels that is not visible to the naked, physical eye.
Maybe you remember it;
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2769.0.html
Thank you and everyone else for your diligent replies.
Peace,
Joe
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: hillsbororiver on March 02, 2009, 06:12:29 AM ---Keep this in mind as well;
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.[/color]
--- End quote ---
Hello Joe,
The one aspect regarding this passage is that is may not be entirely scriptural:
Excerpt from 'How We Got the Bible' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5815.15.html):
Now for the last few years I’ve been looking at all these things, about the return of Christ, the millennium and the kingdom and all these things. I haven’t written to much about that yet. You know why? Because I don’t understand it! But now I’m getting there and here is a Scripture in Revelation.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him a thousand years.
v. 3 And he cast him into the bottomless pit (abyss), and shut him up and set a seal on him, that he should deceive the nations no more until the thousand years should be fulfilled. And after that he must be loosed a little season.
That verse gives me a problem, it would take a long time to explain why. Believe me most people that teach and write books on these prophecies, don’t have a clue. Not only do they not have the answers, they don’t even know what the problems are.
But these verses here;
Rev 20:4 …And they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
v. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Both of these verses can not be true, there is a problem here. I racked my brain, in my spare time, but I kept it in the back of my mind for a long time. There is a problem, that won’t work and I can’t make it work. It doesn’t fit, there is no way to make this thing fit. Then some months ago, now I know why it, “But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished” won’t fit. It’s not Scripture! Tischendorf has it right there.
-Rev. 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished
It’s not in the Sinaiticus. So I said, okay now we’re moving again. We’re a little closer to the Truth.
Now in regards to John 19:14 & Mark 15:25, what is the standard numbered hour system for the ancient Jews? What I mean is, at what time does the numbering start (1st hour, 3rd hour, sixth hour, etc.) and when does it end and what numbers are used? Hope that makes sense...I'm just trying to understand, no offense.
Marques
Kat:
Hi Joe,
--- Quote ---my point is that these accounts are much deeper than some literal, historical biography of physical events that transpired 2000 years ago. There are spiritual meanings behind these accounts that I believe lie beneath the surface.
--- End quote ---
I totally agree that there are spiritual meaning to all Scripture, beyond the physical. But I do believe that we need to have the physical worked out correctly first, then comes the spiritual. I was just sharing my understanding of those 'feast' and 'Holy' days from my years in WWCG.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
ecrement:
Tradition has Him ministering for Three Half years, has this been documented fact or is their another time to consider. One fact is His second year of ministry was silent or not much happen during this year. What do you think Jesus Ministry time was according to the gospels.
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: mharrell08 on March 02, 2009, 09:52:43 AM ---
--- Quote from: hillsbororiver on March 02, 2009, 06:12:29 AM ---Keep this in mind as well;
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.[/color]
--- End quote ---
Hello Joe,
The one aspect regarding this passage is that is may not be entirely scriptural:
Excerpt from 'How We Got the Bible' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5815.15.html):
Now for the last few years I’ve been looking at all these things, about the return of Christ, the millennium and the kingdom and all these things. I haven’t written to much about that yet. You know why? Because I don’t understand it! But now I’m getting there and here is a Scripture in Revelation.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him a thousand years.
v. 3 And he cast him into the bottomless pit (abyss), and shut him up and set a seal on him, that he should deceive the nations no more until the thousand years should be fulfilled. And after that he must be loosed a little season.
That verse gives me a problem, it would take a long time to explain why. Believe me most people that teach and write books on these prophecies, don’t have a clue. Not only do they not have the answers, they don’t even know what the problems are.
But these verses here;
Rev 20:4 …And they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
v. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Both of these verses can not be true, there is a problem here. I racked my brain, in my spare time, but I kept it in the back of my mind for a long time. There is a problem, that won’t work and I can’t make it work. It doesn’t fit, there is no way to make this thing fit. Then some months ago, now I know why it, “But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished” won’t fit. It’s not Scripture! Tischendorf has it right there.
-Rev. 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished
It’s not in the Sinaiticus. So I said, okay now we’re moving again. We’re a little closer to the Truth.
Now in regards to John 19:14 & Mark 15:25, what is the standard numbered hour system for the ancient Jews? What I mean is, at what time does the numbering start (1st hour, 3rd hour, sixth hour, etc.) and when does it end and what numbers are used? Hope that makes sense...I'm just trying to understand, no offense.
Marques
--- End quote ---
Hi Marques,
Your point about Rev 20:5 is well taken, I wish Ray had expounded on this a little more as this chapter does appear to say that those who are not a part of the first resurrection are raised up after the thousand years.
Here is the entire chapter without verse 5;
Revelation 20
1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 Deleted
6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
11And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
It seems that this is saying that after the Millennium there will be another resurrection, doesn't it? I am open to a better interpretation always....
As far as your second point about when the Jewish day begins it actually begins at sunset, that is a new day (24 hour cycle). Entire Jewish days though are divided by nightime (first) daytime (second) so if the sun rises at 6 A.M. the third hour of the day would be 9:00 A.M.
No offense taken! ;)
Peace,
Joe
P.S. Hopefully I will be able to address more comments later.
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