> General Discussions
Hope of the Resurrection
markn902:
What a nice topic :) you're right Samson I don't think about this enough...
Terry:
So, as mentioned by Ray in the above Emails, Jesus and The Chosen Elect are raised spiritually, but will be able to manifest themselves in the physical in order to be seen by everyone else(Wicked, unbelievers, etc) that's Resurrected. Ray indicates that everyone else will be resurrected in a physical body that's not Immortal or deathless(Greek-Athanasia). Read excerpts from His article: Physical or Spiritual Resurrection Bodies for wicked & Unbelievers below.
The major prophecy concerning the resurrection is found in Ezek. 37. Here we are shown a valley of “dry bones” which God says represents “the WHOLE House of Israel” -- “And He said unto me, `Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel; lo, they are saying: Dried up have our bones, And perished has our hope, We have been cut off by ourselves” (Ezek. 37:11).
So the whole House of Israel dies in a condition of being “perished” with no “hope,” and are “cut off.” But what does God tell Ezekiel He will do for them?
I am prophesying, and lo, a rushing, and draw near do the bones, bone unto its bone."
Eze 37:8 “And I beheld, and lo, on them [are] sinews [tendons, strength, muscular power], and flesh [muscles, fat, etc.] has come up, and cover them does skin [the outer covering of a physical body] over above--and spirit there is none in them."
I know of no “spiritual” tendons, muscles, fat or skin, that are put on physical “bones” to remake a “spiritual” man. This is a PHYSICAL resurrection of the dead, Eze 37:10 “And I have prophesied as He commanded me, and the Spirit comes into them, and they live, and stand on their feet--a very very great force” (Ezek. 37:10).
Notice that it takes the spirit from God to give these dried bones life once more. They then “stand on their feet.” This is the exact and precise definition of the word “resurrection.” It means to “stand up” upon one’s feet, but the word itself has nothing to do with being “spiritual” or “immortal” whatsoever. Jesus raised a little girl and Lazarus from the dead, and they stood up on their feet and lived—they were not made spiritual bodies or given immortality. Likewise those saints resurrected at Christ’s resurrection, were not given spiritual bodies or immortality.
Nowhere are the wicked promised immortality or incorruption, nowhere.
1Co 15:50 “Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”
Chapter 15 is speaking of the true Elect Saints of God “inheriting the Kingdom of God. Is the act of raising the wicked from the dead and act of their “inheriting the Kingdom of God?” I think not. Will the wicked then “inherit incorruption” at their resurrection? Well many say “YES, yes they will.” NO, no they WON’T! Are men like Mao Tse Tung, Adolph Hitler and Saddam Hussein, who are among the most “corruptible” men who have ever lived, going to be given bodies that are “incorruptible?” Do the Scriptures lie when they tell us that “corruption” (as in the above named persons) does NOT “inherit incorruption?”
Should Mao, Adolph, and Saddam be resurrected to incorruptible and immortal bodies, then death would also be “swallowed up in victory” in THEIR LIVES ALSO. How could they go through the “second DEATH” if “death” would have already been “swallowed up in VICTORY” in their miserable, wicked, vile, and deranged carnal minds? Such people know nothing of “the law of the Spirit of LIFE in Christ Jesus.” They know only of “law of SIN AND DEATH” (Rom. 8:2).
Is there anywhere a Scripture that presents the resurrection of the wicked in such a glorious, and holy, divine light? I think not. Rather we are presented with this as the characterization of the resurrected wicked to eonian judgment:Dan 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting [eonian] life, and some to shame [rebuke, reproach, disgrace] and everlasting [eonian] contempt [repulsion, aversion, abhorrence].
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Thanks Samson for your post I just can’t get past this one thing though, the elect will be raised Spiritual and not flesh and blood I get this,
But the rest, all the rest will be raised with or in a physical body flesh and blood just as they had when they died so what I’m trying to understand is will these in the physical bodies when they go through the Lake of fire and repent receive spiritual bodies as the elect or keep the flesh and blood physical bodies that they were raised with and live on without the worry of death anymore I wish I could put down on paper what’s going on in my head.
Since the elect will reign and rule during this time it’s seems as if they will be Gods new Government over the rest of the second resurrection but for how long or forever I don’t know.
I feel like a dog chasing his tail right now so I’ll leave it here for now and maybe pickup on it later,
Blessing
Terry
Kat:
Hi Terry,
1Cor 15:25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
v. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death.
So Christ and the Elect will rule until "He has put all enemies under His feet." Then we can see what is to happen to all of humanity.
1Cor 15:28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.
1Cor 15:24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.
So all of humanity will eventually be brought into the kingdom, when God is "all in all" and they would have to be spirit to be in the kingdom. Then everybody will be a part of God's family.
1Cor 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption.
Here are a couple emails on this subject.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,1529.0.html --------------
The "Kingdom of God" is the kingdom that will rule the nations under the Kingship of Jesus Christ, composed of lesser kings, lords, priests, and judges. These kings, lords, priests, and judges, are composed of the ranks of God's Chosen Elect Saints.
Only those worthy of the First resurrection from the death will ever rule with Christ in the Kingdom of God. Those who are judged, purified and saved in the Great White Throne Judgment will be in God's family, but they will never be rulers with Christ.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6964.0.html --------------------
We have but three Scriptures which speak directly on things that endure the consummation of the ages, and continue throughout the Kingdom of God, and are stated to "have no end," or suggest "no end." I will not speculate at this time beyond what the Scriptures specifically tell us, although I believe there is move to be gleaned from them, but I will reserve my thoughts on that till a later date.
[1] Luke 1:33-- And He [Jesus] shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever [Gk: 'eons'--plural]; and OF His kingdom [His 'kingdom,' not His 'reign'] there shall be no end.
COMMENT: Jesus' "reign" lasts "for the eons," or "a thousand years." I will explain the spiritual meaning of "a thousand years" in future Installments of my "Lake of Fire" series. So the reign of Jesus ends (I Cor. 15:25), but what was accomplished through His reign (that which is "OF" His Kingdom), will have "NO end."
[2] (KJV) Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end
(ASV) Of the increase of his government and of peace there shall be no end
(Bishops) He shall make no ende to encrease the rule & peace
(CLV) To the increase of the chieftainship, and to the welfare shall be no end
(Rotherham) Of the increase of dominion, and of prosperity, There shall be no end—
(YLT) To the increase of the princely power, And of peace, there is no end
COMMENT: So these things will not only continue into eternity, they will increase: "government & peace," "rule & peace," "chieftain ship & welfare," "dominion & prosperity," "princely power & peace."
[3] "That God may be ALL in all" (I Cor. 15:28).
COMMENT: I believe that the "may be" in this verse carries the connotation that after all the things that go before (Jesus bringing ALL enemies into subjection and death abolished) that the next phase of God's purpose is now read to BEGIN. I do not believe that God being "All in all" is the "end" but the "beginning" of a whole new world! I may have more to say on this in future studies.
God be with you,
Ray
Terry:
Thanks Kat i see it now what a beautiful love story the scripitures give us.
Blessing Terry
HoneyLamb56:
I continue to marvel at the insight of everyone on this forum; once again I have gleaned something from reading this thread that I had not paid attention to before or had forgotten what I had read.
Has anyone thought about what minds one will have when raised in the judgment? Will one remember his old life (memories); how will one know how carnal they are to go thru the judgment by the elect if they don't remember? Does one start a new? I don't get the resurrection from this perspective.
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