> General Discussions
1 Cor 15:51
Kat:
When the day of the Lord's wrath comes, it will not last a little moment, that is the great white throne judgment of the world that last for an age, "For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet" (1Cor 15:25). However there are those who want to hide from Him though...
Rev 6:14 Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place.
v. 15 And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains,
v. 16 and said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb!
v. 17 For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?"
I just cannot accept the idea that the elect will escape/hide from the Lord's wrath, as they that will sit on the throne with Christ to judge the world.
Rev 3:21 To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
octoberose:
Such a good discussion. I hope I don't take it to the weeds. ;D
My question is , the elect meet Christ in the air - both those alive at the time He comes and those who are resurrected from the dead who are HIs. Then everyone else who has ever died is resurrected for the great white throne judgement. Now, I'm thinking physically and not spiritually but does everyone now live on the earth? Or does this take place somewhere else? What do all these people do? Where do they live? How does that work? I know- I think in simple terms. Do we have any idea?
I thought that the New Jerusalem would be after the judgement was over- so, I can't wrap my head around all this. Do you have an understanding of this?
zvezda:
--- Quote from: Kat on March 09, 2016, 06:24:30 PM ---
When the day of the Lord's wrath comes, it will not last a little moment, that is the great white throne judgment of the world that last for an age, "For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet" (1Cor 15:25). However there are those who want to hide from Him though...
--- End quote ---
Okay, I see where the confusion is. It seems that you think the Lord's wrath is the same thing as the judgement day.
I just think they are two events -
1) the Lord's wrath will come first, he will send punishment on the people of the earth, it will bring destruction
Isa 26:20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.
Isa 26:21 For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.
Luke 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
2) After the wrath/indignation has passed, then the judgement begins, the people of the world will learn righteousness.
Isa 26:9 With my soul have I desired thee in the night; yea, with my spirit within me will I seek thee early: for when thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness.
judgement = correction, not punishment, that's why I think Lord's wrath and judgement are not the same thing.
Kat:
zvezda, the day of the Lord is the great day of His wrath has come that I just showed you in Rev 6:17 and that is the judgment.
Rom 2:5 But in accordance with your hardness and your impenitent heart you are treasuring up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,
Job 19:29 Be afraid of the sword for yourselves; For wrath brings the punishment of the sword, That you may know there is a judgment."
--- Quote from: octoberose on March 09, 2016, 07:20:34 PM ---Such a good discussion. I hope I don't take it to the weeds. ;D
My question is , the elect meet Christ in the air - both those alive at the time He comes and those who are resurrected from the dead who are HIs. Then everyone else who has ever died is resurrected for the great white throne judgement. Now, I'm thinking physically and not spiritually but does everyone now live on the earth? Or does this take place somewhere else? What do all these people do? Where do they live? How does that work? I know- I think in simple terms. Do we have any idea?
I thought that the New Jerusalem would be after the judgement was over- so, I can't wrap my head around all this. Do you have an understanding of this?
--- End quote ---
These questions always come up... it's an curious topic for sure. We do know there is the first resurrection of the elect, then the rest of the dead after that, "in his own order" (1 Cor 15:23). What does that mean? Will there be stages of resurrection? It does not specify, but that comment makes you wonder.
But however it comes about I have confidence that God has considered every detail and I'm sure His plan is prepared to take care of every need. Revelation 21 says there will be a "new earth" and in chapter 22 it says v. 3 "there shall be no more curse"... does that mean those from Genesis? Maybe He will change things so the earth will be a more accommodating place to live, nature can be quite hostile now. But Scripture says the reign of Christ in next age will take place on earth.
Rev 5:10 And have made us kings and priests to our God; And we shall reign on the earth."
Luke 11:2 So He said to them, "When you pray, say: Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name. Your kingdom come. Your will be done On earth as it is in heaven.
New Jerusalem - is "prepared as a bride adorned for her husband," (Rev 21:2), it is the temple of God, and that is made up of the elect.
Rev 3:12 He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.
I've already given Scripture that show the elect rule with Christ on His throne (Rev 3:21), not literal physical huge throne sitting on earth somewhere, but it mean they will be given power and authority under Christ.
1Cor 6:2 Do you not know that the saints will judge the world?
These are the Scripture I see on these things, that's what I go on.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
Dave in Tenn:
Rom 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
1Th_1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.
1Th_5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
Zvezda seems to be linking Isaiah's prophecy to Paul's words. I agree.
So then the elect are saved from the wrath to come. Are they involved in it? It is HIS wrath, and only He knows how to do it. We are saved from it.
Rom_12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
Several times we are told not to have or exercise wrath. Do the rules change? What I find hard to believe is that He is going to require the elect to do something for which they have no practice, or are out of practice. And we had best be "out of practice".
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these...wrath, ...and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Let HIM do the work He knows how to do, and that He claims for Himself.
Where are the elect in this "timeline"? Maybe here?
Rev_11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
And afterwards?
2Co 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
That, we may be qualified to do.
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