> General Discussions
1 Cor 15:51
indianabob:
Hi Michael,
Thanks for the reply. Much appreciated.
I note that the quotes that you supplied are all future tense. In other words we have the sure and certain promise of God and If we are the elect then God will bring our change to pass, absolutely certain.
However, we should not expect to measure up to what we will be while we are still mortal. We sin every day and God through Christ has to keep working on us daily. Perhaps we see some small improvement compared to what we were before being called, but this is as nothing compared to what we will be when our change comes.
My further point then is that we should not be discouraged by our human limitations and lack of personal improvement, doubts, fears, frustrations, that we may find in our self examination. God has planned from the beginning to do the whole job. None of us will be able to please God by results caused by our own efforts. It is all God's work in us.
If you have further critiques please send them, I do want to learn and be corrected.
Indiana Bob
--- Quote from: Michael G on March 11, 2016, 11:03:59 PM ---Hi Bob, your quote
--- Quote ---but bears repeating is "that none of us will be already perfected or qualified or have been made acceptable when Christ returns.
--- End quote ---
John 5:24 (KJV)
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
John 6:39-40 (KJV)
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Romans 8:34-39 (KJV)
34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord
1 Peter 1:3-5 (KJV)
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Revelation 2:17 (KJV)
17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.
1 John 3:2 (KJV)
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
1 John 3:1 (KJV)
3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
1 John 5:1 (KJV)
5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
Romans 8:14-15 (KJV)
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Galatians 3:26 (KJV)
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 4:6 (KJV)
6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
2 Thessalonians 2:13-14 (KJV)
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
AS HE IS SO ARE WE IN THIS WORLD...
Sorry Bob but I don't agree with that statement, thats just a few scriptures out of hundreds that say no to your statement.
R P J
Michael
--- End quote ---
Mike Gagne:
Hi Bob. Bob I think these scriptures quoted are in the present!!
1Jn 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
1Jn 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: ( and what proof do we have) therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
1Jn 3:2 Beloved, NOW are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
Ephesians 2:4-5 (KJV)
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Romans 8:14-15 (KJV)
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, ( and who is led by the Spirit, the elect) they are the sons of God.
15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Galatians 3:26 (KJV)
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 4:6 (KJV)
6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
1Jn 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.
Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
If one thing that I remember LRay saying is we must believe the scriptures!! I underlined that which states it in the present.
R.P. J
Michael
indianabob:
Hi Michael,
My understanding is that we have an "earnest" or a down payment, a declaration of intention through the indwelling of God's spirit, Christ's spirit.
So then one may say that we are "begotten" of God in this life, but we are not yet born of the spirit. We have a great change coming in our future based upon God's promise and we need to continue in faith trusting that God will fulfill His promise.
Check the full definition of the scripture where you read "born", I think it is better rendered begotten. (moderators correct me please)
For example, I know in myself that I still am weak and subject to temptation.
After I am born of the spirit of God I will have strength similar to that of our Lord Jesus and no longer be under temptation.
Does that explain a little better? I hope...
Indiana Bob
Mike Gagne:
Hi Bob, yes Iknow that the only one born of God is Jesus. But your quote stated that none qualify now and that's the part I don't agree with. All my scriptures say that we are qualified. That's all . And why are the elect qualified, because they died and if that includes me, I died and there for my life is hid in In Christ and as he is in this world some am I. I must believe the scriptures. Do you have scriptures that say we are not the sons of God. And if you do please show them to me or else I have to believe what the scriptures say!
In Christ Michael
Mike Gagne:
Hi Bob, here is some scriptures that say we are born of God
1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
1Jn 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: ( and as he is so are we in this world born of God ) and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
1Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
Born
G1080 (Strong)
γεννάω
gennaō
ghen-nah'-o
From a variation of G1085; to procreate (properly of the father, but by extension of the mother); figuratively to regenerate: - bear, beget, be born, bring forth, conceive, be delivered of, gender, make, spring
In Christ Michael
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