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SAVED
Redbird:
What about the following;
Col 1: 12-14
Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 21
And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled.
John 1: 28,30
Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst. 30 When Jesus therefore received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and gave up the ghost.
When I pray - give us this day, our daily bread and forgive us our trespasses, I know in my heart "THE BIG KAHONA" has been taken care of. It's the little daily "waves" I ask for forgiveness and help with. Like becoming the people God already knows we are.
Hope this makes sense!
Lisa
Deborah-Leigh:
I think this fits with what you are saying Lisa.
Heb 4 : 15 For we do not have a High Priest Who is unable to understand and sympathize and have a shared feeling with our weaknesses and infirmities and liability to the assaults of temptation, but One Who has been tempted in every respect as we are, yet without sinning. 16. Let us then fearlessly and confidently and boldly draw near to the throne of grace, the throne of God’s unmerited favour to us sinners, that we may receive mercy for our failures and find grace to help in good time for every need appropriate help and well-timed help, coming just when we need it. 8)
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
rocky:
--- Quote from: Kat on January 18, 2007, 06:58:19 PM ---Hi Arcturus,
Good topic.
Wouldn't saved and born again be about the same idea.
As we are only begotten now, we are sealed with the earnest of His Spirit now.
2Co 1:22 And He has sealed us and having given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
When Jesus returns those raised or changed will be Spirit and born into the kingdom.
Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
Here is an email of Ray's on saved.
http://bible-truths.com/email12.htm#saved ---
[Ray Replies]
Dear Margaret:
"How do we KNOW that we are saved?" Excellent question! Would you believe that the Scriptures do not answer this specific question? If they do, I am not aware of such an answer. The problem in answering this question is that you put it in the PAST TENSE--"How do we know that we ARE saved" which, I guess, could be in the past or present tense. Either way, I know of no Scripture that gives such an answer.
Here is what we do read regarding salvation:
"might save" "to save" "shalt save" "save us" "shall be saved" "such as should be saved" "whereby we must be saved" "we shall be saved" "what must I do to be saved" etc., etc., etc.
And even those few verses that speak of "but unto us which ARE saved...." a closer look at the Greek shows that it is in the aiorist tense and should be translated "...which ARE BEING saved..." as it is not as yet a completed fact or act.
Even Ephesian 2:8 which states: "For by grace ARE you saved through faith...." which is properly translated with the word "are" than "are you being saved" or some other aiorist tense verb, still does not show that anyone is ALREADY saved. The phrase "ARE saved" is telling us HOW we are saved, not WHEN we are saved. We "are" saved by grace just as people a century into the future also "ARE saved by grace." That's HOW they are saved, not WHEN.
If there were a verse that stated that we or anyone ARE or HAVE BEEN already saved, it would contradict many other Scriptures that show that salvation is an ongoing process.
This verse says it all:
"But he that shall endure unto the end, the same SHALL BE saved" (Matt. 24:13).
If this verse be absolutely true, can a statement that contradicts this statement of our Lord ALSO be true? Well, for example, "...he that shall NOT endure unto the end... ALSO be saved?" See the contradiction?
Jesus says to him that OVERCOMES... seven time in Rev. 2 and 3. If the "overcoming" part is really not necessary, then why is it emphatically stated such SEVEN TIMES?
Is there a reason for not having a verse stating how one can know that they are absolutely SAVED [past tense] at some point in their lives? I think so. We can NEVER STOP overcoming, striving, pressing on, following after, etc. We can have CONFIDENCE AND HOPE that we will be saved if we continue in our present total devotion to God, but never in this life can we say that we "ARE saved" already, in the past tense.
God has not, however, left us with assurances that we can absolutely bank on, if we follow His admonitions. Here is just one:
"And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; and to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; and to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brother kindness charity [LOVE]. For if these things be in you and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful... give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye DO THESE THINGS, YE SHALL NEVER FALL" (II Pet. 1:5-8 & 10).
God be with you,
Ray
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mercy, peace, and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
Hi Kat, could you explain to me or refer me to the difference between begotten and born again. I don't have the ability to do "audio", which I think is where Ray talked about it in the past.
The scriptures are clear we can be "sons" uihios now, so what do we become after being born again??
thanks.
Redbird:
Yes, Arcturus, I like that!! Thank you dear sister.
Lisa
Kat:
Hi Rocky,
If you look at 1 Peter 1:23, you will see born again, and I'm sure a lot of Christians use this verse and others like it to say they are born again.
1Pe 1:23 since you have been born again, not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through the living and abiding word of God;
But the word born also means begotten. To say we are born now, does not fit with so many other scripture.
G313
anagennaō
From G303 and G1080; to beget or (by extension) bear (again): - beget, (bear) X again.
Jesus explains this Himself, when He says one must be born of Spirit to enter the kingdom.
Now we have been begotten and Christ is in us, but in the kingdom we will be Spirit, as Christ is now Spirit and we will be like Him, 1 John 3:2.
John 3:3 Jesus answered him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."
v.4 Nicodemus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?"
v.5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
v.6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
v.7 Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
v.8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit."
I really like what Paul says here about our hope for salvation.
Contemporary English Version
Rom 8:16 God's Spirit makes us sure that we are his children.
v.17 His Spirit lets us know that together with Christ we will be given what God has promised. We will also share in the glory of Christ, because we have suffered with him.
v.18 I am sure that what we are suffering now cannot compare with the glory that will be shown to us.
v.19 In fact, all creation is eagerly waiting for God to show who his children are.
v.20 Meanwhile, creation is confused, but not because it wants to be confused. God made it this way in the hope
v.21 that creation would be set free from decay and would share in the glorious freedom of his children.
v.22 We know that all creation is still groaning and is in pain, like a woman about to give birth.
v.23 The Spirit makes us sure about what we will be in the future. But now we groan silently, while we wait for God to show that we are his children. This means that our bodies will also be set free.
v.24 And this hope is what saves us. But if we already have what we hope for, there is no need to keep on hoping.
v.25 However, we hope for something we have not yet seen, and we patiently wait for it.
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
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